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Home Topics in Depth Activism Justice Democrats: Go Big or Go home (Medicare for All)

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14 replies
  • The Crone (2771 posts)
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    1. Doesn't Justice Dems have as part of their deal the fact that

    The Young Turks are their overseers? And what i remember about TYT is that they wanted Hillary, as after all, (CAN’T for the life of me remember their reasoning, but CRAP on a stick, I hate them now. Except for Jimmy Dorey and one or two others.)

    Anyway my own principled stand is that I want Universal HC. However I  am quite able to figure out who on the upcoming ballots will get it for me. I will never again donate to any org that might in the future give my monies to a Hillary or a Corey Booker. (And thank goodness for the legal battle about how We Bernie Supporters had the DNC take our money and then give it away  to HERSELF against our wishes!)

    I earned my money. I have the right to simply put it in an envelope and send it off to a local candidate, who is going to be grateful and is certainly not going to hand it over to Hillary or one of her ilk. (Or have it stolen from them.)

    "Let us not seek the Republican answer nor the Democratic answer but the right answer." John F. Kennedy   America is the only country that has real   lemons in its furniture polish, and artificial lemon flavoring  in its lemonade!
    • Charles (983 posts)
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      2. The Justice Democrats only support Berniecrats. They give no money to the party

      itself or establishment candidates like Clinton or Booker.

      I respect you may not want to support this group or any others. I understand many want nothing to do with reforming the Democratic party and respect their independent stance. It would be awesome if we can all work towards greater gains for issues like Medicare For All whether inside the Democratic party or from the outside and partner when it is possible.

      Hopefully others who may want to try and reform the Democratic Party understand though that the  Justice Democrats DO NOT give money to the party or establishment candidates.

       

      From the Justice Democrats website

       

      We are recruiting incredible people to run for Congress in 2018 in a unified campaign behind a single plan to fix our government and our country.

      Justice Democrats are selfless leaders from all walks of life and all areas of our economy and society, representing every community. We want a Congress that looks like America (and America does not look like a bunch of wealthy lawyers). We’re looking for people who:

      • Are respected in their communities with a track record of service in their jobs, neighborhoods, religious organizations, charities, etc.
      • Have a history that shows they won’t sell out in DC, because many of their life choices have put others in front of their self interest
      • Agree with the Justice Democrats platform. They need to believe that America already has everything it needs to fix our economy, our healthcare system, our schools and our justice system — and that we can just do it if we have people in office who aren’t just catering to corporations
      • Will be strong fighters who will fight for big change and will not buckle under pressure
      • Are non-dogmatic, optimistic people who believe the American people can build our country by working together
      • Do not have any disdain or condescension for any group of Americans and have a high level of empathy
      • Are good at what they do
      • Are trusted by the people they currently serve
      • Are not people who have spent a life in politics for the sake of advancing their own position
      • Are ideally someone involved in doing work that actually keeps our country going: nurses, teachers, engineers, workers, moms and dads, social workers, veterans, law enforcement, first responders, managers, etc.
      • Have the skills that would make them good candidates against experienced incumbents — they’ve got to be able to talk, and to develop a grasp of all the major issues affecting their district
      • Represent their district and will be someone people in their district can relate to and trust

      Remember, we are not looking for self-nominations! If you can’t find one person who would nominate you for office, you probably don’t have a future in politics ;)

      https://justicedemocrats.com/Nominate

       

       

      Here is a link to the Justice Democrat’s platform:

      https://justicedemocrats.com/Platform

       

       

       

       

       

      As for Cenk supporting Hillary over Trump:

       

      Cenk was all over the Clinton corruption issues including the Doug Band 12 page Teneo email to Podesta:

       

       

      Cenk obviously felt even as corrupt as Hillary was that Trump and the GOP controlling the entire show would be much worse for progressive progress, bad for the poor and working class, and bad for the environment. I don’t consider voting against Trump and for Bernie’s planks in the Dem platform a bad thing as I too voted this way.

      We all know the Dem establishment would try to ignore Bernie’s planks but wouldn’t it be better to be fighting for progress on those issues rather than fighting to stop Trump’s GOP destruction from that point of view? Their is absolutely NOTHING progressive coming from Trump and the GOP.

      One of the first thing Trump did after winning was to put an end to the Clinton pay to play scandals so he could start doing the same thing only for billions instead of millions.

      If Hillary had won the GOP controlled congress would be all over the corruption and it would be dealt with. Now it’s being ignored. Clinton is regaining stature and Trump is doing the same damn thing only on a much grander scale.

      We never got to finish what was started with exposing the Clinton corruptions and making the changes necessary so the Trump’s and the Clinton’s of the world don’t turn America into their billion dollar con game again and again.

      And truth be told I believe the online press and Wikileaks were getting very close to blowing the lid off the scandal until Trump’s victory snuffed everything out.

      The Trump presidency will be a dark part of American history in my eyes.

      My 2 cents….

  • resist99 (72 posts)
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    3. Fighting the corruption of the corporate democrats.

    We need to fight what has become of the Democratic party in every way possible. They are out of control. It seems like the Justice Democrats is a good idea. I have not done a lot of research on them. However I did watch one of the Sane Progressives videos where she pointed out what seems to be reasonable concerns about them. The biggest one to me was that there was already a big name person with a lot of corporate money that already had influence on them. She made some other good points as well though. It seems that the Democrats have been fighting against reform for some time and I worried that this particular attempt may already be short circuited. Has everyone seen the video I am talking about? I think it is important. If others have seen it I would welcome any input. If you haven’t I will try to find a link.

     

    My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth. -George Washington ... We could start by cutting the Defense Budget and stopping all the war propaganda.  
    • resist99 (72 posts)
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      4. I think this is the video that I was talking about.

      There has been a few others since then and I have not watched all of them on this particular topic but I think this is something that people should be aware of at least for the information even if you have answers to what she says.

      *I am watching this video again (it has been a while) and this may not be the video I was talking about. This one talks a lot about the problem of election fraud. She points out that without dealing with this fraud specifically, people will not be able to be voted in. This seems like a decent argument as well, but I will have to find the other video I was talking about.

       

       

      My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth. -George Washington ... We could start by cutting the Defense Budget and stopping all the war propaganda.  
    • resist99 (72 posts)
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      5. Here is the video talking about the ties to corporate dems

      In this video she talks about Howard Dean already having influence on the Justice Dems. She also suggests that it might be better to give money directly to the candidates you like. One reason is that different organizations often have money given to them for specific reason but end up giving money to the Democratic Party instead. There may be candidates that you are not happy with etc. If you give money directly to the candidates you like, these problems are not an issue. Following the Justice Dems may be a good way to find out about good candidates, but it may be better to go right to the source. At least that is a lot of what  she says here.

       

      My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth. -George Washington ... We could start by cutting the Defense Budget and stopping all the war propaganda.  
      • Charles (983 posts)
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        6. JD replied on Twitter that they have nothing to do with Dean, Brock, or Soros

        If the Sane Progressive has documents or other factual evidence that states otherwise that you can point to it would be worth looking into. Otherwise I will stick with Justice Democrats and their push for Bernie’s issues like Medicare for All….

         

        • resist99 (72 posts)
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          7. I was just wondering

          I did not look but her youtube videos usually give links. Her arguments sound very reasonable though. You don’t think she makes sense? Giving good candidates attention is great, but taking money in ways like this seems to create problems, not solve them. You did watch the video right? I would like to hear why you disagree. She really makes good points.

           

           

          My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth. -George Washington ... We could start by cutting the Defense Budget and stopping all the war propaganda.  
          • Charles (983 posts)
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            8. I started to and regret it. She is being completely speculative and offers only

            some weak tie to Howard Dean.

            Those aren’t facts showing Dean’s involvement. That’s just the Sane Progressive’s theory based on trivial hearsay.

            Meanwhile the Justice Democrats are pushing for Medicare For ALL which I support.

            And the Sane Progressive is doing what to help that issue or any progressive issue?

            Sorry. The Sane Progressive is long on opinion and short on facts all the while pouring cold water on any attempt to move forward IMO. That’s not my cup of tea.

            The JD may prove to be a failed effort or it could get co-opted by big money. So far neither has happened. And I’m not going to sit by idly worrying that it could happen because of some random speculation by an internet blogger with no solid plans of their own….

             

             

            • resist99 (72 posts)
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              9. Thanks for your answer.

              After I posted the video, I watched it again. I admit the Howard Dean involvement is not terrible strong. Not hearsay because what she says happened, but certainly not conclusive either. I am completely for things like Medicare for all as well. As for what the Sane Progressive is doing, she is point out the problems with certain plans like the one that the Justice Democrats have. She backs up what she says with things that have happened in the past. I agree, the Howard Dean thing is not worth worrying about. However, many other groups like the Justice Democrats all have the same problems. Isn’t it reasonable to want to give money directly to the candidates that you find important rather than giving it to some group? Groups which often end up giving money directly to the Democratic Party and not the the Candidate you were interested in to begin with? They would most likely pick many candidates I would be happy with. However another problem is that you may not be happy with all of them, but you are stuck with their choices. When the Sane Progressive gives advice that it is better to give money directly to the candidate you want, because their is no concern that they will not get all of the money that sounds like good advice to me. I think that is doing something. I think she has made the point that Bernie Sanders did not need such a group to have a good campaign, after all he was the real winner of the primary. Candidates like him just need more attention. They don’t really need groups to get money for them. Having good candidates that get the attention they deserve allows them to get their own funds. I think pointing these things out is a great service so listening to such advice when it makes sense is worth doing. I hope you understand the way I see these things.

              My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth. -George Washington ... We could start by cutting the Defense Budget and stopping all the war propaganda.  
              • Charles (983 posts)
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                10. It's always a concern that a group will change. Act Blue allows a platform for

                candidates to get donations directly.

                People can donate directly to candidates and set up a personal campaign to help raise funds for a candidate at Act Blue.  Act Blue does make money doing it but it’s an easy, trusted, and effective way to get money directly to  candidate or issue.

                As for JD they as a collective group have laid out a strong basic issues related platform  , they don’t allow candidates to take corporate money,  they seem pretty well organized, and hopefully they will have an impact on the issues.

                At some point people need to decide what they are gong to do and what group or groups they will trust to be involved with. A person’s decisions will change as things move forward with their support for particular groups changing or growing stronger.

                I still support Our Revolution which is the one Bernie was involved in starting. They have more potential conflicts and they have been quieter than Justice Democrats so I am more focused there.  When Lee Camp gets things rolling with the People’s Party and draft Bernie I’m sure I’ll be supportive of much done there as well.

                The same would be true if  it is the Greens, an Independent, a Socialist, a corporate Democrat, or a Republican does something to make things better.  State ballot initiatives are also a great tool for democratic change and hope 2018 brings many important issues to a public vote in those states.

                Basically I will support a coalition of groups, candidates, and ballot initiatives in an effort to achieve the change on issues that are not only progressive issues but issues that have shown majority support by the American people in recent polling. …

                 

                 

                 

                 

                 

                • resist99 (72 posts)
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                  11. I understand

                  I just don’t think anything you have said, addresses the fact that the benefits of these groups do not out weigh the problems. No matter how trustworthy a group is today, who knows what happens tomorrow. When you can just give money right to the person you want, why take a risk? Is there something I am missing? I don’t see why it is not better just to cut out the middleman. Wouldn’t it just be better to do what TYT is already doing by giving good candidates time and allowing people to hear where they stand without getting in the way of money when that can only make problems?

                  My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth. -George Washington ... We could start by cutting the Defense Budget and stopping all the war propaganda.  
                  • Charles (983 posts)
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                    13. Support who you want how you want. But to say a group does no good

                    because others have failed or been co-opted by big money isn’t really fair is it?

                    Who knows what happens tomorrow indeed. Perhaps the Justice Democrats of today become the majority in the Democratic party tomorrow.  Not every good intentioned group fails. True some fade but they did good work while they were formed.

                    Throughout history many groups have formed to work for change and gotten results. JD has only been around 3 months. Hopefully their effort can be given a chance before we declare it useless and corrupt without evidence?

                    If you just want to support individual candidates and issues that’s fine. But I’m not sure why some are so against people organizing to work for progressive change and social justice.

                    The corporations and establishment controlling both parties are well organized and I welcome those willing to organize to inform voters, elect quality candidates, and push for progressive policies. The progressive movement is  very splintered currently. We are going to need all the organization and help we can get ….

                     

                    • resist99 (72 posts)
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                      14. Yes, you are right

                      Don’t get me wrong. I am not saying the group will do no good. I think we need to attack our problems as many was as we possibly can. I was just trying to point out a few things. It seems to me like people in the media could be doing exactly what they are doing without bringing money into it, and that if they did it could even be more helpful. All they would have to do is report on candidates they like and why they like them. … This is whoever, this is what they are standing for, they do not take corporate money, and this is how you can donate directly to them. … To me that seems like it would be a whole lot better. That is just how I see it. Another huge problem is with our elections, so even if this was very successful, more things would have to be done.

                      I am not saying they are not trying to do a good thing, and I hope they are able to do everything they want to do. I was just trying to point out some things that were mentioned because I think it is important to think about. I hope I did not bother you. I do thank you for talking about it with me.

                       

                      My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth. -George Washington ... We could start by cutting the Defense Budget and stopping all the war propaganda.  
                • resist99 (72 posts)
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                  12. I guess I just want to point out what Happened to Bernie

                  I don’t see how these groups solve these problems.

                   

                  My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth. -George Washington ... We could start by cutting the Defense Budget and stopping all the war propaganda.