AOC going full Biden

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    • #315049
      N2Doc
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      • Total Posts: 8,568

      AOC joins Biden’s climate policy panel

      Progressive U.S. Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez will serve on a panel advising Joe Biden on climate policy, the apparent Democratic presidential nominee and the Congresswoman’s spokesperson said.

      https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/aoc-joins-biden-s-climate-policy-panel-n1205886

       

      Biden, Sanders name leaders of their ‘unity task forces’ — including AOC

      https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/13/biden-sanders-unity-task-forces-leaders-aoc-254456

    • #315051
      Bearian
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 616

      .If you can’t Beat ’em Join ’em.

      • #315107
        bazukhov
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 2,910

        Gosh.  Another fallen angel with wings of clay was found to be a  few inches of purity.

        Or, maybe, a leftist politician trying to find a way to govern that will move the country to decency.

        Tell me, great captain, how do the angels sleep when the devil leaves his porch light on? Tom Waites

    • #315052
      Ohio Barbarian
      Moderator
      • Total Posts: 17,963

      “There are very real, tangible areas where Democrats even fell short perhaps during the Obama administration that I think I would like for us to have a plan to improve.” –Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

      Perhaps Democrats fell short during the Obama years? Perhaps? No, they didn’t just fall short, they didn’t even fucking try. Don’t ask me to support you, AOC, not after that denial of reality. That’s retrenchment. That’s ass-kissing. I cannot respect that.

      It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

      Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

    • #315054
      MizzGrizz
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,665

      ..after having been burned by Elizabeth Warren.

      This is one of those times when a cynic just hates to be right.

      But it’s true—you can’t come to Washington and change the system.The system changes you.

      In ten years AOC won’t even be recognizable to herself.

      • #315068
        rudycantfail
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 296

        She’s a big time climber.

        • #315073
          Ohio Barbarian
          Moderator
          • Total Posts: 17,963

          It is actions, and inactions, that count. At least for me.

          It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

          Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

      • #315070
        Earthartist
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 1,017

        Same here MissGrizz. I think I am now supper cautious when someone rolls out like she did and suddenly becomes the darling of the left out of nowhere.  People who drive movements have been working within for a long time they don’t come out of thin air

        Earthartist

    • #315065
      Electrolyte Orchestra
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      • Total Posts: 354

      The Unity Commission is to try to get progressives to vote D in November.  Whatever planks they come up with are for show, just like Obama’s 2008 campaign promises.  The “professionals” will populate a Biden administration and completely ignore whatever this commission develops.

      • #315074
        Ohio Barbarian
        Moderator
        • Total Posts: 17,963

        @mistap AOC is willingly participating in a sham. I don’t think she’s stupid enough to think it’s not a sham. It’s also an effort to propagandize everyone on the left from democratic socialists to New Deal/Great Society Democrats into supporting a Fascist with really bad character flaws who may have Alzheimer’s.

        This is what saying she’d vote for Joe Biden lead to, the sheep pen where good little progressive Democrats go to seek forgiveness from their wiser elders. Nope. Homey ain’t going there.

        It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

        Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

        • #315201
          PolecatHollerer
          Participant
          • Total Posts: 1,257

          Honestly, @ohiobarbararian, she’s been making my spidey-sense tingle since day one.

          She came out of nowhere, talked some big shit, and took a very lucrative position from an experienced, deeply entrenched member of the ruling party…an untouchable MOB BOSS(D) who basically sat back & did nothing while she racked up poll numbers, and then quietly left office without comment. Believable much? Not to this hillbilly!

          Now, she’s almost totally morphed into a “Blue no matter who” DNC crapagandist.

          I wish I could say I was surprised. She struck me as a MOLE from the get-go, and not a very believable one…. and now she’s doing all the things a not-very-believable MOLE would do.

          Surprise surprise surprise!

          If you give a man enough rope, it will be six inches too short. This is not the nature of rope- it is the nature of man.

    • #315066
      elias39
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      • Total Posts: 5,241

      She probably thinks it’s the best she can do under the circumstances and maybe she’s right. But that’s more an indictment of the system than it is of her. If she can twist one arm, that’s one more for our side.

      Hey, I’m trying to think positive.

    • #315072
      Fasttense
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      • Total Posts: 1,309

      Seems to me Biden might have made a mistake and thought he was talking to Candace Owens….she just gave a speech at Liberty University. He has a habit of mixing up people. He mistook his sister for his wife or viceversa; so I’m not sure he got the person he thought he got.

    • #315079
      Pam2
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 6,594

      They know what needs to be done! They just don’t want to do it.

       

    • #315081
      NV Wino
      Moderator
      • Total Posts: 6,062

      I haven’t given up on AOC. I do know that political office changes people, but I hope she can maintain her integrity and still remain in office to influence, even in a small way, future decisions.

      “As we act, let us not become the evil that we deplore.” Barbara Lee
      “Politicians and pro athletes: The only people who still get paid when they lose.” William Rivers Pitt

      • #315093
        a little weird
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 708

        I don’t see what else she should do.  If she can influence anything by being on this panel then it is better for her to be on it than not.  How does that make her “going full Biden”?  Damned if you do and damned if you don’t I suppose.

      • #315131
        Bernin4U
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 457

        …one way to protest it is to resign/distance yourself from it.

        Her choices are to make herself an accomplice, or to say, “we’ve already been doing this, so you can just go ahead and adopt our policy.”

        But to open the door to / join forces with incrementalism is to bail on a true GND. She’s co-signing for them to co-opt it into nothing useful.

    • #315083
      salemcourt
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,123

      Jimmy Dore had a segment on AOC and her support for Pelosi and the dems.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLo8GtAjIFo

    • #315089
      mmonk
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 900

      Not while there is stimulus money going to fossil fuels.

      Fear not the path of Truth for the lack of People walking on it. - RFK

    • #315092
      Iorek
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 30

      I see this as part of living to fight another day. You’ve got to know when to fight and when not to. I see her as trying to get what she can given the circumstances and then live for another day.
      As for Bernie, I think he ran out of energy. Remember his age and the heart attack he had last fall.  He’s got a hell of a legacy for younger progressives to build upon.

    • #315112
      RufusTFirefly
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,464

      We’re talking about the fate of the Earth here. Not some sort of petty ego trip.

      I’m still not going to vote for Biden, but isn’t it better to have people like AOC in positions of power and influence instead of just standing on the sidelines stomping her feet?

      • #315128
        N2Doc
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 8,568

        She won’t influence a damn thing. You can be sure of that. She is just there as window-dressing for the oligarchs. And she damn well knows it.

        ‘Fate of the Earth’ Oh! The Drama! If you really think she is going to change anything except a few words on a meaningless document that will be ignored by all in power, I have a bridge to sell you…

        Ultimately, none of this will matter when Groper Joe loses in November.

      • #315132
        Bernin4U
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 457

        And not give credence to incrementalism, that we all know (they can’t even help but add “unity”) is just for show (votes) anyway (pandering to anyone left of Reagan).

      • #315155
        closeupready
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 1,671

        he never ever compromised (to my knowledge, though of course, he’s not divine, he’s human, so he probably did on something, but I am not aware of it).  No.  Instead, he has always been that crazy liberal college professor from the 70’s and 80’s who you remember calling for nuclear disarmament and (as a Jewish man) a Palestinian state and more democracy/less oligarchy.  And in very vivid, hard-hitting language, fearless even.  Few other American intellectuals command as much left-wing respect as he does.  And it didn’t happen that way because he submitted to the pod people; it happened because he stuck to the truth.

        AOC may have a bigger plan here, as others are speculating.  Who knows.  But if her plan fails, she’s still pretty much set for life; her constituents and voters aren’t.  They need her voice and representation.  We’ll see what happens.

        The opinions and personal views expressed herein are solely those of the author, and should never be taken seriously.

        • #315160
          Cold Mountain Trail
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          • Total Posts: 10,353

          “set for life”

          as a one-term congressperson?  i don’t think so.

        • #315162
          RufusTFirefly
          Participant
          • Total Posts: 2,464

          Obviously, he’s no flash in the pan. His radical credentials are unquestioned.

          And yet.

          • #315299
            closeupready
            Participant
            • Total Posts: 1,671

            Do you have a link, or perhaps I’ll just google it.  Thanks.  (I was editing when you posted the link, thanks.)

            EDITing to remove off topic stuff.

            The opinions and personal views expressed herein are solely those of the author, and should never be taken seriously.

            • #315302
              RufusTFirefly
              Participant
              • Total Posts: 2,464

              @closeupready

              He gets to the heart of it about five minutes in:

              Chomsky makes the argument that getting rid of Trump is absolutely essential. Also, he conjures up what he considers to be an analogous situation from 1930s Germany, where the failure of the Communists and Socialists to unify led to the control of the German Reichstag by the Nazi Party.

              • #315775
                Cold Mountain Trail
                Participant
                • Total Posts: 10,353

                On August 30, 1932, in the shadow of the rising Nazi power, Clara Zetkin–German Marxist and member of the Communist Party of Germany (KPD)–opened what would become the last session of the Reichstag (Germany’s parliament).

                As the oldest member of the assembly, Zetkin was its chairwoman.. She used her speech to call for all working and oppressed people to unite to smash the fascist threat…By the following January, the “Machtergreifung” (seizure of power) took place: President von Hindenburg appointed Adolf Hitler as Chancellor of Germany on January 30. The Reichstag was dissolved. The Communist Party was banned…

                 

                LADIES AND gentlemen! The Reichstag is meeting in a situation in which the crisis of collapsing capitalism is showering the broad laboring masses of Germany with a hailstorm of the most terrible suffering. The millions of unemployed, who are starving either with or without the beggar’s allowance of social welfare, will be joined by additional millions during the autumn and winter. Increased hunger is also the fate of all the other people who happen to be on social welfare…Growing numbers of artisans and small tradesmen as well as small and middling peasants are being ruined…The collapse of the economy and shrinking of the subsidies for cultural activities are destroying the economic basis of existence for all those who work with their minds.

                In spite of the omnipotence of the Presidial Cabinet, it has until now totally failed in both its domestic and foreign policy. Its domestic policy is distinguished, like that of its predecessors, by emergency legislation which creates emergencies by increasing the emergencies which already exist…

                For the government, those in need consist of big landlords, bankrupt industrialists, big bankers, shipyard owners and unscrupulous speculators. Its tax, tariff and trade policies take from the broad strata of the working population in order to reward the small special interest groups.

                It worsens the crisis by putting restrictions on consumption as well as on import and export goods. Its foreign policy harms the interests of the working people. It is guided by imperialist designs and allows Germany to waver irresolutely and dilettantishly between unabashed subservience and saber rattling…It tries in vain to make people forget about its moral and political guilt by its strife with its allies over the distribution of state power...

                The impotence of the Reichstag and the omnipotence of the Presidial Cabinet are symbolic of the decline of bourgeois liberalism and the collapse of the system of production…

                The policy of the Papen-Schleicher Government is merely the undisguised continuation of the Bruning Government (that had been tolerated by the Social Democrats) which had, in turn, been preceded by the example-setting policy of the Social Democrats. The policy of “the lesser evil” strengthens the feeling of power of the reactionary forces and it’s supposed to create the greatest of all evils: the passivity of the masses…

                The Reichstag could indict the Reich’s President and the Reich’s Ministers for violations of the constitution and in case of further violations to take them before the State Court at Leipzig. To take them before this high court, however, would be to accuse the devil before his grandmother.

                It is obvious, of course, that a parliamentary decision will not be able to break a power which is based on the Reichswehr and all the other supporting agencies of the bourgeois state as well as the terror of the fascists, the cowardice of bourgeois liberalism and the passivity of large sections of the proletariat…

                Intervention by the state has failed because the bourgeois state does not control the economy, but the capitalist economy controls the state…

                As the power apparatus of the possessing class, it can only operate to its advantage and at the expense of the producing and consuming masses…

                THE MOST important immediate task is the formation of a United Front of all workers in order to turn back fascism…

                Before this compelling historical necessity, all inhibiting and dividing political, trade union, religious and ideological opinions must take a back seat…

                https://socialistworker.org/2014/01/10/fascism-must-be-defeated

                 

          • #315305
            Earthartist
            Participant
            • Total Posts: 1,017

            As he has aged he said stuff that makes me feel sad. Like supporting Biden but he has been doing this more and more

            Earthartist

      • #315170
        Populist Prole
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 525

        If she is sporting a new bruise on her, along the lines of the one Bernie did during his 2016 campaign. I wonder if they appeared before an “assembly” someplace and given “the talk”.

      • #315176
        Ohio Barbarian
        Moderator
        • Total Posts: 17,963

        This whole task force thing is utterly meaningless. @rufustfirefly

        It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

        Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

        • #315180
          RufusTFirefly
          Participant
          • Total Posts: 2,464

          If I remember correctly, 13 people in the audience were arrested for protesting the total absence of anyone on the panel espousing Medicare for All. And yet, given that it was clear from the outset that Baucus was a tool of Big Pharma, had someone supporting M4A made it on to the panel, would we have been right to condemn him/her as a sellout and an enabler?

          I see some similarities between that situation and the current one.

    • #315129
      Satan
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 3,831

      But I did unsubscribe from her e mail list- along with pretty much all the other political e mail lists I was on- yesterday.

      Just don’t need 666 emails a day begging me for money in the middle of a goddamned depression.

      "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable". - John F. Kennedy

    • #315165
      Jim Lane
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 627

      I mean, there’s no real difference between her and Louis Gohmert, right?  And since the Democratic Party is on its last legs and ripe for destruction at the hands of aroused progressives, the race should be easily winnable, right?

      • #315182
        Ohio Barbarian
        Moderator
        • Total Posts: 17,963

        @jimlane That’s a cheap rhetorical trick, going to the rhetorical extreme. Of course AOC isn’t Gohmert, but she owns it to the degree she votes just like him, and her pattern tells me she is trying to ingratiate herself with the Democrat leadership in an attempt to preserve her own career. They may redistrict her seat out of existence, and they will do nothing to help her win re-election, so I think her cooperation with them may be futile, anyway. Or, her district may like her enough to send her back, election fraud or no.

        Nancy Pelosi, however, and other top Democrats are like Nicholas II, however. They learn nothing and forget nothing. And they’re not going to give progressives shit when they don’t have to–AOC and Bernie handed them that situation on a silver platter.

        And nobody said the Democratic Party is on its last legs. I think it’s worthless and won’t support it, as do a clear majority of Americans, but a clear majority also thinks the Republicans are worthless. A plurality doesn’t like either one, but we have no other effective choices because we do not live in a democracy.

        It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

        Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

    • #315168
      Maedhros
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 709

      it does seem clear to me that this is a calculated move by the Biden campaign.  NOT to ensure that fresh, new ideas are brought to the table, but as a milksop to progressives as a means to entice their votes.  “See how progressive Biden is?  He appointed AOC to a toothless advisory panel!”

      His body recovered from his torment and became hale,
      but the shadow of his pain was in his heart;
      and he lived to wield his sword with left hand
      more deadly than his right had been.

    • #315215
      Babel 17
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 4,031

      You never go Full Biden.

      “Free yourself up to believe that it was OK to be stupid, or dumb”

      No, just no.

    • #315773
      SinMentiras SinVerguenza
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 55

      When Obama got elected, someone wiser than I opined that, “he’s too young and he’s not ready”.  For four years, whenever he did something stupid or sellout-ish I would hear “see, he’s not ready”.   By the sixth year though, it became clearly apparent that it wasn’t preparedness that was an issue but rather complicity in the ugly side of a sellout politics.  This weasel ran to the left and governed from a corrupt right.

      When AOC got elected, I was presented with the same wisdom.  “She’s not ready,” …  “she’s not going to know what to do” …   and so on.

      The difference in the two is this … “There is NO DIFFERENCE!!!!”

      They are actors in an age old question …  How long before the eager, idealistic candidate becomes the Jaded officeholder and succumbs to the established order of the day.   They may face the age old question that do-gooders face when having to work within a herd of sellouts.  Do I swallow hard and vote for the corrupt thing so that in the future they (Pelosi & Posse) will help me with what I want.  Let’s call it the Pudding and Shit Theory.   You eat a little shit so you can get your pudding later.   Problem is ….  THERE IS NEVER ANY FUCKING PUDDING STUPID!!!  Before you know it, the same fuckhead Chuck Rocha “adviser” type who convinced you to vote with the Pelosis tells you that now you can still get re-elected BUT “your going to need some CASH”.  Why?  Because what got you elected evaporated the minute you started listening to the Carville-Matlin-Rocha-type whispering in your ear as he hands you the day’s agenda.

      Every $$$$Stinkin’ time!!!!  The only difference between AOC’s seduction and that of Obama’s was the scale of the tragedy.  In Obama, the Rock Star Express fired up and flung his arrogant ass in global fashion.  With AOC, the Express was limited to the national rail system.  With Obama, subservience to the .0001% began immediately followed by a flogging of the 99% economically as well as physically.  With AOC the lapdog serum took awhile to work. But, given the Thunderdome nature of the current reality, it is much easier for a freshman congressperson to get re-elected using the machine apparatus in place rather than fighting the battle on three fronts.  You have to fight with the DNC machine, primary opponents, pissed-off fossil fuel lobbyists, and on and on ….   Better to accede a bit AND THEN ….  Yeah. Right.  “paved with good intentions” and all that rot.

       

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