Clinton lost… because Russia…

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    • #7772
      David the Gnome
      • Total Posts: 3,529

      We have entered, it seems, an even more astonishingly dishonest era.  One in which not only do people take no responsibility for their own faults – or for losing an election – but one in which it seems the entire system of government and media is complicit in assisting them in doing so.

      Remember weapons of mass destruction?  Nothing.  Nobel peace prize?  Yet, there are American troops in Iraq right now.  Remember “impeachment is off the table”?  Now, once again I give you… speaker Pelosi – the little multi millionaire that could.

      She is so strong!  Hillary is the best qualified!  Saddam had to go!  Obama fixed the economy!  Citizens United?  Trump?  Fake news?  Russia!!!!

      Not sure how much longer I can stomach this nonsense.  The mighty USA farked chit up all on it’s own.  Always we blame the wrong people.

    • #7776
      • Total Posts: 10,951

      …Her loss is explainable by many other things that actually make sense.


    • #7777
      • Total Posts: 154

      I agree, this is all nonsense. HRC lost, people need to get over it and move on!

      Forcing people to work without pay is akin to slavery.

      • #7874
        • Total Posts: 12,005

        Well, they like single payer too, and we haven’t yet managed to get that.

        Jesus: Hey, Dad? God: Yes, Son? Jesus: Western civilization followed me home. Can I keep it? God: Certainly not! And put it down this minute--you don't know where it's been! Tom Robbins in Another Roadside Attraction

    • #7780
      • Total Posts: 2,548

      Granted, in 2000 and 2004, there was some actual funny business going on with voter lists and voting machines, but that didn’t stop Democrats from defiantly drawing the wrong conclusions from these debacles.

      • #7787
        David the Gnome
        • Total Posts: 3,529

        Now, as it turns out Gore actually should have won – but nonetheless, our third way friends still blame the wrong person.  Nader, oh yes, who single handedly took… 2%? 3?  Less?  I don’t remember the numbers, but people who voted for him were not likely to otherwise vote for Gore – and even if they had done so, it wouldn’t have mattered.  Game was rigged.

        Of course… it still is.  Now they blame Stein, Bernie, Russia, Assange, the working class.  Severely outnumbered so called conservatives.

        Are they incapable of genuine reflection?  Introspection?  Can they not even see the deep rot in the system?  It seems as if they are blind to anything that does not fit within their narrow minded views.

      • #7807
        • Total Posts: 3,202

        unless they adopted the same tactics themselves–that helps explain Brock, that helps explain Maddow’s newfound membership in the Western Goals Foundation

        so voter caging, closing polling places, long lines are all something that they didn’t challenge 2000-02 so they could keep it in their back pocket

        the Dems were always a top-down “machine” party since like the 1840s and in the 1990s had turned on the blue-collars that machine politics relied on, and knew there’d be either a backlash within the party or a defection to the GOP like with Nixon and Reagan: the trigger was Sanders (rather than Obama), they pulled out all the stops after Iowa

        and all the while they can beat the drums of outrage as the GOP does the same in AA communities for the general election

    • #7797
      • Total Posts: 2,998

      The ones she was trying to get weren’t got no matter how “moderate” and “not as bad” she tried to appear to be.  They either sat it out or voted for The Boy.

      She did manage to win the most votes but not enough in the right places and the totally undemocratic Electoral College provided her with her ticket to Palookaville. .

      Tell me, great captain, how do the angels sleep when the devil leaves his porch light on? Tom Waites

      • #7895
        • Total Posts: 8,811

        The primaries were run in an UN-democratic way – the DNC has now openly stated it has the right to choose the candidate it wants, regardless of primary results (thus the superdelegates), so saying the EC is un-democratic when it does not suit the DNC is ridiculous.  Hillary was not chosen democratically in the first place.  Maybe if the DNC had gone with the actual popular favorite, things would be different, eh?  In any event, looks like the EC saved us from Hillary and the Third Way, so it is good for something.

        America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

        "Sometimes when I try to understand a person's motives, I play a little game. I assume the worst. What's the worst reason they could possibly have for saying what they say and doing what they do? Then I ask myself, 'How well does that reason explain what they say and what they do?'" GRRM

        A YouTube comment – we need new conspiracy theories – the old ones have all come true.

    • #7839
      Mr. Mickeys Mom
      • Total Posts: 8,177

      What I’d like to see is a flood of total sunshine on what she was part and parcel to in the 2016 primaries and why Bernie let them hand him his hat.

      Hell, no... I'm not giving up...

      • #7951
        • Total Posts: 2,998

        The DNC managed to convince the Democratic voters to vote for her in the primaries.  Enough to win the nomination.   They (mostly she) didn’t manage to convince enough liberals/moderates to vote for in the general.

        Do you think that the EC is democratic?   She won the popular vote but Trump won the electoral vote.

        I think that if any other Democrat had won the nomination they would have trounced the obviously unfit for office Trump.

        Tell me, great captain, how do the angels sleep when the devil leaves his porch light on? Tom Waites

    • #7878
      • Total Posts: 4,184

      seem to blame everybody for her pathetic loss except the people who actually cast a vote for Trump!

      All governments lie to their citizen's, but only Americans believe theirs.

    • #7880
      • Total Posts: 1,854

      I really and truly hope that we at JPR are not the outliers. I want to believe that the majority of the citizenry gets it that ‘our’ so called government is hardly ours and the same can be said of ‘our’ media.

      While i am forced to take into account that my paradigms stem from a very small slice of rural western Washington State,  have not once found a voter who felt represented by ‘our’ government.

      If i learned anything from the race to 2016, it is that the citizenry, regardless of politics, is sick of not being represented. We do not trust ‘our’ government.

      While every thing you say is true, i would argue that it all stems from the same source and that source is not We The People. I further believe that while the citizenry may be fooled here or there, our wholesale mistrust of ‘our’ government means that we are just not buying into b.s.

      My response here is not meant to be disagreeable, it is instead meant to show support for things you yourself often say in other posts and OPs: Have faith in the citizenry…the fight for truth and justice is not over.


      • #7963
        David the Gnome
        • Total Posts: 3,529

        Seriously though, I get it.  I didnt really mean to suggest “we” as in we at JPR.  Still, I have a crapload of people on Facebook, in my family – among my circle that honestly believe its all Russia’s fault.  Some here are a bit on the fence about what actually happened – but most of us dont blame Russia for Trump.  I hope.

        As for Americans overall, I agree with you.  The problem is that a large number of Democrats – all of whom will vote – buy the Russia narrative in its entirety.

        Old habits die hard.  I need to stop using “we” when talking about Democrats, I’m not one anymore.  As far as faith in humanity goes?  All the way, my friend, through the gates of hell, hand in hand if need be.

    • #7901
      • Total Posts: 2,538

      Few people not named Clinton believed that “Clinton lost … because Russia”. Few people not named Trump believe that there should be no investigation.

      Bernie seems to believe that there was election interference and it should be investigated, but that there are many more important progressive issues (single payer, free college, progressive taxes, climate change action, anti-war, etc.) that need to be focused on while the Mueller investigation proceeds.

      When you think you have no choice but to start a war, think again. Wars promise to be quick, clean and decisive. Wars lie. They cause more problems than they solve, they just won't tell you that beforehand.

      "If we are to have peace on earth, ... our loyalties must transcend our race, our tribe, our class, and our nation; and this means we must develop a world perspective."

    • #8150
      Cold Mountain Trail
      • Total Posts: 13,289
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