Giver and taker states

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    • #437026
      • Total Posts: 9,978

      Jesus: Hey, Dad? God: Yes, Son? Jesus: Western civilization followed me home. Can I keep it? God: Certainly not! And put it down this minute--you don't know where it's been! Tom Robbins in Another Roadside Attraction

    • #437033
      • Total Posts: 6,439

      is figured into this.  Oh, my state, Florida, gives more than takes, evidently.  This is just more divisive bullshit.

      America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

      Everything I post is just my opinion, and, honestly, I would love to be wrong.

      • #437049
        • Total Posts: 2,965

        For example, if you use GDP as a measure of income, California pays 11%, Kansas, the reddest of red states, pay 22%.  New York pays 17% while both Nebraska and Missouri pay 19%.  So all this giver and takers is bullshit from the vote blue no matter who folks.

    • #437037
      • Total Posts: 126

      What you see at the level of states in that map is actually even more asymmetrical if you look at economy size and income disparities between greater metropolitan areas vs rural America.

      With the polarizing of American politics into metros vs rural all asymmetries people don’t see the geodemographics of the asymmetric distribution of resource production and resource consumption areas as parts of the same system.

      If you are a Dem leaner your focus is on metros and cities and their rings of suburbs. Any taxes not spent there are politically exploited and turned into evidence of resource producing areas not carrying their fair share.

      This asymmetry has existed for millenia, and has only gotten more pronounced in modern society. Do people ever remember why coal mining areas are so impoverished? Do they have any understanding why there are so many empty storefronts and new ghost towns emerging in Iowa?

      It’s a shame that our politics so exploits our narrow points of view to so effectively contribute to never looking beyond the simplistic interpretations of ink on maps to find the greater reasons and understanding about why the regional contrasts of such maps exist.

      Seems like progressives would be interested in being sure that all people would get a fair benefit from advances in communication, transportation, health and education no matter where they live.

      Ending the pandemic needs a shot in the arm.


    • #437040
      Ohio Barbarian
      • Total Posts: 21,760

      If everyone benefits from tax dollars, fewer complain about it. But this isn’t what we see. No, we see “red” states taking in more federal dollars than they contribute as opposed to “blue” states contributing more, and Blue Team cheerleaders get to feel righteous by bashing hypocritical, selfish, greedy red-staters.

      This is an old divisive tactic that liberals never tire of, and never do anything about, either.

      It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

      You can jail a revolutionary, but you can't jail the revolution.--Fred Hampton

      • #437043
        • Total Posts: 1,917

        But I wonder how much that is the fact that a lot of the military are located in red states. I remember this argument when talking about middle east wars. Instead of good people programs money spent on those wars was allowing poverty to continue in the states who got most of their money for military instead of using it for human needs.


    • #437073
      David the Gnome
      • Total Posts: 3,230

      @djean111 is right.  This is just more divisive bull shit.  Don’t think so?

      Okay, so the argument is that red states are takers because they have more people getting federal or state benefits, right?  Hmm.  Now I wonder what percentage of this “taking” is social security, medicare, medicaid, etc.

      By that logic, I am a “taker” as are all people who get some kind of benefit.  Us.  Not the billionaires and millionaires and their institutions and the fact that they widely engage in complete evasion of taxation.

      Interesting idea.  Personally, I think the takers are those motherfucker that keep cutting education, infrastructure, food stamps and housing – the fuckers that charge 10k for a medical test – and hundreds of thousands for a couple weeks in the hospital.  The sneering fuckwits like Bezos that insist that they deserve billions in incentives for putting a building in a city.

      The politicians that tell us 2000 dollars is too much.  That the wealthy are “risk takers”.  It is a crock of shit.  All of it.  Worse, this kind of shitty political posturing blames the victims of this FUBAR system of oligarchy.

      Same bull shit that goatfucking pile of puke Reagan pushed about so called “entitlement queens”.  Oh, dress it up as you like, but it is the same damn thing.  Punching down.  Sneering academics, latte liberals pushing more shit.

      Why do you think so many who call themselves democrats bitch about “those kind of people” – you know, the ones too poor to throw money at their campaigns?  Could it be that it is not so secret that both parties view the poor with contempt?

      The difference is, a Democrat will sneer and a Republican will rage.  Good actors all – but useless fucking trash as regards examples of the human race.  These people should be the ones on the ground overseas.  Let them fight their own fucking wars.  Let them work for minimum wage.  Takers and givers…. Heh.

      I think we know who the real takers are.

      • #437077
        retired liberal
        • Total Posts: 4,276

        We are being sold a bag of moldy lies by both sides and even some here don’t get it.
        The richer one gets, the more of a parasite one become on society. The rich get tax deferments, tax write offs, tax loopholes, tax advantage written into the law, the rest of us can’t by any stretch of the imagination take advantage of.
        It is the rich that rule over the rest of us. You need to be well off to run for Congress. Most become multi-millionaires while in Congress.  Then help pass laws to make their corruption legal. Pass laws to help enrich their wives/husbands, relatives.
        The Red states are run by conservative, rich fucks to further enrich themselves and their friends. They see the less well off, i.e., normal people, as parasites on society, not themselves. The Blue states are governed a little better.
        Even though Kansas is a Red state, it now has a Democrat governor. The previous governor was Brownback (he should be in a federal lockup). He and his Republican legislature came within a razors edge of totally bankrupting the state. The current legislature is still trying. Mostly the governor’s veto pen and the State Supreme Court, has turned the state around.
        Brownback’s administration cut taxes and cut them some more and use the lack of money as an excuse to cut school funding, safety net funding, Department of Motor Vehicles, any other agency whose purpose was to help the people. He maintained cutting taxes increases state revenue. That has never proved to be the case anywhere.

        We are an arrogant species, believing our fantasy based "facts" are better than the other person's fake facts.
        If you are wrong, it will be because you are not cynical enough.
        The older we get, the less "Life in Prison" is a deterrent.
        Always wear a proper mask when out and about. The life you save could be both yours and mine.

      • #437202
        • Total Posts: 9,978

        You don’t “take” any more than people in blue states.  Of course SocSec, Medicare and Medicaid also take in a proportional amount compared to what is paid out.  IMO it would be a great idea to lift the tip income for Soc Sec by a hell of a lot.

        Jesus: Hey, Dad? God: Yes, Son? Jesus: Western civilization followed me home. Can I keep it? God: Certainly not! And put it down this minute--you don't know where it's been! Tom Robbins in Another Roadside Attraction

    • #437191
      • Total Posts: 3,711

      The corrupt politicians giveth and the crooked rich taketh in all 50 states. The rest of us paupers get the crumbs.

      All governments lie to their citizen's, but only Americans believe theirs.

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