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Home Main Forums 2018 Elections Glenn Greenwald explains the CIA wanted Clinton and is attacking Trump.

  • Carolab (1114 posts)
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    Glenn Greenwald explains the CIA wanted Clinton and is attacking Trump.

    We know how Hillary lost it – but how did Trump win?  Despite the (limited) results of Stein’s recounts, there may have been cheating in WI and MI.  PA might have been hacked with Rove’s help, if you follow Cliff Arnebeck’s reports.  Or perhaps Cross-Check which was present in 23 states, if you follow Greg Palast.

    senz, mrdmk, whispers and 9 othersBabel 17, Pastiche, bbgrunt, 7wo7rees, Ichingcarpenter, GZeusH, Passionate Progressive, WillyT, Peace Patriot like this

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    • kelly (427 posts)
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      1. I have stated many times over the last year and a half

      the only constituency that mattered this election was the National Security State.

      Did it really lose?

      that possibility seems so slight, but perhaps mirrors the failure of unlimited money

      and media influence to install HRC.

      if this was a legitimate election, and the people overcame,

      well all right.

      • Carolab (1114 posts)
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        2. If Deep State was involved then why didn't the CIA manage to "win"?

        That is the biggest question of all.

        Was it the DeVos and Prince families and the fact that the Congress is full of Christian Dominionists?  Could their reach be that strong?  Did they pay Rove to rig it for Trump?  I thought he was working for Hillary?  Was it a double-cross?

        Something is clearly “off”.

        • jwirr (4130 posts)
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          3. Or did they just ignore the Bernie movement and how angry the American

          people are.

          • Carolab (1114 posts)
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            4. That has been my position.

            Enough people hated Hillary to begin with and the DNC rigging it all for her just sealed her fate.

        • Flygirl (3018 posts)
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          5. Or they got complacent in places they should not have

          perhaps they THOUGHT they had it Stolen by enough..when in fact they undercut themselves in places they should not have or in states with Repub Governors where it would have been too obvious ..like Florida..

          she thought she had Fla in the bag…they were manipulating the poll numbers..

          I am in the anchor county on the I-4 corridor…I never saw one..not one Hillary sign..I saw one Hillary bumper sticker..I could hardly find one Democrat that would vote for her other than the local DEC people…nada..there was zero support for her…but to steal Fla she had to go past our Repub governoer..she couldn’t do it…so plan B Pa..they thought they had it stolen..but they didn’t steal enough!! They underestimated the numbers they needed!!

          I don’t think they counted on so many democrats not voting at all or voting for other candidates.

          According to the DNC I am a Wife of a Taco Bowl Member!
          • Carolab (1114 posts)
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            6. Then why did they constantly inflate her poll numbers?

            That would seem to run contrary to a goal of propelling “her” voters to the polls.  Instead, it appears to have backfired, badly, either keeping people away who figured she “had it in the bag” or they went out to vote against her.

            • Flygirl (3018 posts)
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              7. To justify stolen vote totals…

              they just didn’t steal enough!!

              or she was promised a steal of certain places..that never actually were accomplished..

              According to the DNC I am a Wife of a Taco Bowl Member!
              • Carolab (1114 posts)
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                8. The exit polls were inflated as well.

                Which would add credence to that.

    • Ichingcarpenter (4151 posts)
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      9. When the CIA realized their plan for Hillary wasn't gonna work

      They pulled out all the stops they could to bring Trump down within the rules

      Russia, Brennan’s statements, etc

      They didn’t do this before the wind was changing for Hillary.

      The fact is Benghazi was a CIA/Hillary fiasco and they knew it.

      Which at first I bought the witch hunt bullshit until I started getting the facts on the case.

      The game is not over , Trump is not gonna win against these guys either but it may expose the CIA even more for what it is to the unknowing masses.


      • Carolab (1114 posts)
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        10. As Glenn said, the "dossier" on Trump was in existence months prior.

        Wasn’t released until the end when, as you said, all the stops got pulled.

        • Ichingcarpenter (4151 posts)
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          11. I'm sure they had a dossier on Hillary

          that goes back years in order to control her. George Bush? Well that’s well known about his felonious past.  Obama?  That’s a curious question unless he was an asset for a long time that we didn’t know about. There were rumors  about that as with Bill Clinton

          Trump came out of so called left field and wasn’t expected to win even though he was promoted. So they had to create something

          If you haven’t seen the movie Snowden yet …….. do…. it exposed a lot and scared the shit out me how they create assets without any conscious or moral standards.

          There is those within the company that are good but few are speaking out for fear of their lives and they say you can never really leave the company aka William Casey

          Don’t forget about the German journalist who died recently either.

          There is a battle going on, that we can only hear the whispers of but its deadly and real.


          • Carolab (1114 posts)
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            13. I did see Snowden.

            It was, as you said, very good and scary too.

            Which German journalist?

    • Peace Patriot (3120 posts)
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      12. That's my read on the s/election, too – the CIA interfered here, as they do…

      …of course, elsewhere in the world, and have done since they overthrew Iran’s first democracy in 1953.  The issue was oil, of course, then as now, and what the CIA did was to turn the Iranian people into a U.S. enemy, when they could well have been an ally.  They directly and with intent overthrew Iran’s first, duly elected prime minister, Mohammad Mosaddegh – he was like the George Washington of Iran – because he nationalized Iran’s oil – something that a country like Norway does without being subjected to U.S. “regime change.”  They furthermore installed the horrible ‘Shah of Iran’ as dictator, who subjected the Iranian people to 25 years of torture and repression.

      And a year later, the CIA overthrew the elected, leftist government of Guatemala, initiating a bloodbath against the poor and against leftist activists and politicians that Guatemala has yet to recover from.

      So that’s what the CIA does.  They’ve done it all over the world.  They’ve done it recently in Ukraine, installing an outright Nazi government right on Russia’s border ( – a country that lost millions of people in their fight against the invading Nazis in WW II).

      The CIA started “regime change” here on Nov. 22, 1963, and have been s/electing U.S. presidents ever since then.  Their covert control of the White House and of our national political establishment was the goal of that assassination, and their additional assassination of RFK (among other things to prevent his gaining the power to investigate the CIA for his brother’s murder **) insured their success.  It’s also important to know how the CIA was put together by Nazi-lover Allen Dulles (the CIA Director whom JFK fired) with a cabal of billionaires, banksters and war profiteers whose successors still rule over us.  This cabal includes the owners of major media which brainwashes the public – Stalin style – to believe that CIA wars are justified and to prevent a public revolt.

      All of this (and much more) has been COVERT until now.  What is fascinating in our recent s/election is that the CIA’s candidate did not win, and that prompted them to come out of their deep dark dungeon in what can only be described as hysterical rage at their loss.  I’ve never seen anything like it in my lifetime (and my political life starts off as volunteer for JFK at age 16 in 1960).  It is unprecedented.

      So what’s behind it?  That is the question.  What went wrong for them and for Hillary?  I have my theories and none of them include Russia.  “Russia did it” is an attempted cover story.  Nope, the election riggers were HERE and vying for power in an internal war.

      Ever since the installation of private, corporate, electronic, ‘TRADE SECRET’ code vote counting systems here – circa 2002 to 2004 (brought to us by a Democratic Congress), our election results have been vulnerable to EASY rigging, for those with the wherewithal to do it.  That is why we have a Congress with an 8% approval rating.  Most of them were not elected, and none of them can prove that they were actually elected.  That is why we have far rightwing**** governors all over the country.  And that is how Bush-Cheney got re-s/elected in 2004.

      We can bet that the CIA would not leave this election rigging capability in private hands for long (- and may have engineered this vote rigging coup d’etat themselves).  But something happened in this s/election that they didn’t count on – or several things happened.  One is the failures of Hillary as a candidate and the consequent failures of her campaign.  I attribute part of this failure to her having been told that she had it in the bag (that it would be rigged for her, if necessary, just as the Democratic primary was rigged) and her conclusion that she didn’t have to pander to voters or exert herself much at all.   Her natural arrogance and hubris kicked in.

      Hillary started off as one of the most unpopular political figures of all time.  She was a bad CIA choice to begin with.  But she still should have demolished Trump, with CIA and across-the-board corporate media help, and all those billions of dollars invested in her, personally, and in her campaign.  A lot of people think that Trump was created by the Corporate Media as an easy foil for Hillary to beat, but the rebellion against Hillary and Clintonism was so profound that it catapulted this unlikely person, Donald Trump, into the White House.  I’m not sure it’s that simple.

      I think a split was developing among our Overlords prior to the s/election.  It developed into an internal war, and we saw some flares from that war go up in the week before the s/election from the FBI.  The split that developed into an internal war had mostly to do with Syria and Russia (and pro-Hillary Neo-Cons vs anti-Hillary anti-Neo-Cons).  There were already U.S. military brass standing down in Syria because it was such a huge CIA clusterfuck.  There are others among our Overlords who want to do deals with Russia, and/or want to ally with Russia against China.

      This is what the s/election was mostly about – wither the Empire?  And I think there was a third factor, which is that some of our Overlords were vulnerable to the FBI investigations of the very corrupt, octopus-like Clinton Foundation, and concluded that they had to stop those investigations – and some of these abandoned Clinton at the last minute.  Her campaign was so lousy that, for her to win, it had to be rigged.  Her rigging teams failed.  And either Trump’s rigging teams succeeded, or he was permitted to win, on the promise that he would stop the investigations of the Clinton Foundation (which he promptly said he would do).

      Also, we cannot ignore the “cui bono?” of the developing Trump administration.  It is a corpo-fascist wet dream of naked predatory capitalism.   Hillary would have done much of the same, but with a “liberal” mask on.  Hard to say which is worse.  The only bit of light seems to be that Trump won’t be risking armageddon, which the Neo-Cons were willing to risk, in their world domination scheme, and some of whom possibly welcomed due to their strange religious beliefs.  (China is also a nuclear power, though, so I hope that the faction that wants Russia as an ally against China stick to economic warfare.)

      There might be a few other lights in the Trump era, but they are likely going to cost us dearly, one way or another.  We may get some American manufacturing back, but with broken unions and very possibly racist hiring.  We may get some restoration of our sovereignty but it won’t be used for protection of the environment or labor conditions.  Since I think Hillary was ready to trade Women’s Rights for a full-on Corpo-fascist Supreme Court, I actually think that the net loss for women is not going to be the catastrophe that many fear from Trump.  And we may get a colony on Mars.  (I was just reading/viewing some stuff on Elon Musk, NASA and Trump.  Quite interesting, actually – and we can certainly use an extra planet.)  (Cost to us?  It could be a positive thing.  We’ll see.)

      The CIA’s hysteria about Trump would be comical if there was not so much evil in their dirty games.  They are master propagandists and brainwashers so we shouldn’t laugh.  Well, a dark laugh or two.

      – – – –

      **(“The Devil’s Chessboard,” by David Talbot.  Another superb book on that era is “JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why It Matters,” by James Douglass.)

      ****(The biggest of these private election rigging corporations – ES&S, which bought out Diebold – has far rightwing connections that would make your hair stand on end.)


      • Carolab (1114 posts)
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        15. Great summary but I think we need to answer one other question.

        What about the Christian Dominionists?  The DeVos-Prince tentacles are far and wide and now they are in the White House.  Will Betsy get confirmed?  A lot of those GOP governors owe their career to them, and Cory Booker does as well (who is defending Betsy).

      • Ichingcarpenter (4151 posts)
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        17. Well that was much more coherent and detailed than my ramblings.

        I am hoping that the Trump time will ignite a revulsion and reciprocal action faster than any Clinton time would have brought … you know the slow boil vs the fast boil.

        Because the world needs a change of direction that neither of these will bring.

        The CIA?  Yes I see that internal fight going on too.

        We are in for a rough ride.

    • jdpriestly (5877 posts)
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      14. My view of the gossip about Trump is pretty much what my view of the release

      of Hillary’s e-mails was.  I don’t care who released the e-mails or who released the gossip about Trump.

      I want to know whether the e-mails and the gossip are true.

      The content of the e-mails was true.

      Now what about Trump’s relationship with Russia?

      Seems to me the truth of that will become evident as time passes.

      People who work for the CIA, etc. will probably be the first to know.  Maybe they already know.

      I’m for more transparency, not less.

      Glenn Greenwald was in favor of the releases of information, etc. that Edward Snowden made.  He should also support the same transparency with regard to Trump’s relationship with Russia.  If the reports or rumors or gossip are untrue.  Then let’s see the evidence that the stories are made up.  It’s hard to prove a negative, but Trump has plenty of time.

      No Truth!  No Trust!  Bernie or Bust!
      • Carolab (1114 posts)
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        16. From what I read Glenn is leaving the possibility open.

        And so is Matt Taibbi who even went so far on Democracy Now! as to claim some of his sources in Russia are pretty sure Russia is involved.

      • arendt (1432 posts)
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        19. False equation of unverifiable gossip with verified emails

        Nobody has found a word of truth in the Trump gossip. If they had, it would be on 24/7. The CIA now claims it didn’t validate the gossip, but they knew exactly what would happen when they attached it to intelligence summaries without content.

        The Trump gossip is nothing more than an overt and illegal CIA interference in domestic politics.

        The CIA behavior toward Trump is the same as the GOP behavior in Benghazi-gate. It is a misdirection. Yes, there was really bad shit happening in Benghazi – the CIA was trans-shipping Libyan weapons to ISIS – but all you got was bullshit about HRC’s telephone calls. Same with Trump, he is doing bad shit, and we are being distracted from real damage by this unprovable gossip. We should focus on substantive, factual issues instead of this witch-hunt.