M-4-A Could Have Prevented 338,000 Covid Deaths

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    • #492115
      Snort McDork
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      • Total Posts: 5,595

      A universal health care system could have saved more than 338,000 lives in the United States by preventing roughly one in three deaths resulting from the COVID-19 infections through March 2022, according to a new study. A single-payer health care system would also have saved the nation an estimated $105.6 billion in health care costs associated with COVID treatments and hospitalizations, leading the study’s authors to conclude that universal health care, often called “Medicare for All,” is both a moral and financial imperative for policymakers.

      Published this week in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences USA, the study and a companion analysis are a stunning indictment of what their authors describe as a “fragmented and inefficient” health care system that leaves millions of people uninsured and underinsured every year. Americans spend more money on health care than people living in any other nation, but the U.S. has sustained 16 percent of COVID’s global “mortality burden” while only representing 4 percent of the world’s population.

      James Kahn, a professor of health policy at the University of California, San Francisco, and a co-author of the study, said the modeling and analysis present a precise estimate of the massive human and financial costs “imposed on the U.S. population by the lack of universal insurance” during the pandemic. Even in non-pandemic years, a single-payer health system would save tens of thousands of people from preventable death annually.

      https://truthout.org/articles/medicare-for-all-could-have-prevented-338000-covid-deaths-in-the-us/?eType=EmailBlastContent&eId=10a0037c-67fa-43ca-871b-12721fe8b6c1

      I'm Snort McDork and I approved this message.

      "I like Birdy Num-Nums"

      If you come for Nina Turner, Your ish better be airtight like Tupperware" -Rashida Talib

    • #492125
      djean111
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 8,808

      Thus increasing health care profits.  Mortality rates are just another way of helping the health care business achieve its goals.  In this specific case, Covid, all mortality has pretty much been blamed on those who did not get vaccinated.  As time passes, that will be set in the stone-like brains of the true believers.

      America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

      "Sometimes when I try to understand a person's motives, I play a little game. I assume the worst. What's the worst reason they could possibly have for saying what they say and doing what they do? Then I ask myself, 'How well does that reason explain what they say and what they do?'" GRRM

      A YouTube comment – we need new conspiracy theories – the old ones have all come true.

    • #492129
      Dunatus
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      • Total Posts: 835
    • #492130
      Mr. Mickeys Mom
      Moderator
      • Total Posts: 8,172

      However, deceit/deception/theft/control over a permenant underclass are great skill sets…

      Now, remember to share your underclass digest with President Biden, and if you call, you are relegated to do so between 11 am and 3 pm Tuesday through Thursday. Every letter will have a controlled response that has nothing to do with your pain.

      This is what Mr. & Mrs. America are willing to put up with until they no longer can…

       

      Hell, no... I'm not giving up...

    • #492133
      retired liberal
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 5,107

      .

      We are an arrogant species, believing our fantasy based "facts" are better than the other person's fake facts.
      If Row vs. Wade is overturned, women could lose the right to not get pregnant in 26 states.
      The Republicans are four year olds. The Democrats are six year olds. There are no grownups.
      Normalizing insanity has been the conservative's sweet spot at very least since the beginning..

    • #492136
      Ohio Barbarian
      Moderator
      • Total Posts: 25,044

      How many Americans kept working until they literally dropped because they had no sick time and were afraid of losing their jobs if they didn’t go in? My own stepdaughter developed walking pneumonia because she wouldn’t take a day off when she had Covid. Yes, at a daycare center, but she had to keep going in to work back in early 2020. And she was in her early 30s and healthy.

      OTOH, I was 61 at the time, but had paid sick days. I took a couple off and got better. My stepkid didn’t until her mom and I took her car keys away from her so she couldn’t go to work, and told her boss dire things would happen to her business if she fired our adult kid. She didn’t get fired.

      Never let your morals stop you from doing the right thing.--Isaac Asimov

      The United States is also a one-party state but, with typical American extravagance, they have two of them.--Julius Nyerere

    • #492144
      David the Gnome
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 3,529

      And the guy who wanted to make Medicare for all happen didn’t get the nomination.  Biden did, Biden who told us to “go out and vote” during some of the worst days of the pandemic.

      I posted a question on Facebook earlier, asking if those who voted for Biden in the primary were having buyers remorse.  The response I got was basically “he couldn’t have won”.  Maybe not.  Maybe, even if he had/or did actually win by the numbers, it wouldn’t have mattered.

      I remember at the primary vote in my little town, sliding my ballot into a machine that… Counts them?  I guess?  And there was some dem, some kind of election monitor or something, watching very closely.  It felt suspicious and weird to me.  Maybe I was just being paranoid.

      No, they will never let us have anything like Medicare for all.  The well off will be able to buy reasonably good plans, while everyone else has either high deductibles and copays, or, if you are, uh, lucky?  Enough to be poor like me, you might get Medicaid, which pays so shittily that a ton of medical professionals won’t take it anymore.

      Also doesn’t cover dental beyond if you’re in pain and need an extraction or a filling – so, generally, once you have an abscess.

      It is… Sociopathic in the extreme – but somehow, the people who voted for Biden weren’t put off by the whole “I’ll veto it if it ever passes Congress” thing.  No no, the demented, hawkish, corrupt old asshole was the only one who could beat Trump, or something.

      I suppose he basically “won” the election.  So, great, we got rid of Trump and got a war in Ukraine, sanctioned the fuck out of Russia (Putin might have actually listened to Trump) and this prick who can’t seem to remember his campaign promises, let alone keep them.

      But, hey, the important thing is… TRUMP ISN’T PRESIDENT ANYMORE!  REJOICE!  WE HAVE SAVED OUR FAKE DEMOCRACY BY REPLACING A SLEAZY CON-MAN WITH A WAR CRIMINAL.

    • #492145
      doh1304
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,905

      by doctors required to follow CDC guidelines? That’s the first argument against M4A I’ve ever heard that I seriously considered valid.

      • #492152
        HassleCat
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 9,177

        Those on Medicare For All might be required to get vaccinated, not just against covid, but against whatever the CDC determined.

      • #492156
        djean111
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 8,808

        Each year it sucks a little more, privatization and such, but so far I have never been required to get a vaccination or, really, anything else.  And with the “direct contract”, wherein the insurance company gets to keep whatever it does not spend of a lump sum, I already see where any treatment at all will be discouraged.  Anyway, I have never had a flu shot – or the flu – and over the years I have been remonstrated against, loomed over by officious nurse aides, had to sign waivers saying I refused and would accept the consequences (no consequences for any damage a shot might cause, of course) and so on.  Same thing for saying Nope to the Covid shot.  I feel as if Medicare recipients have gone from being sort of a captive medical demographic to just little profit centers, really.  And most doctors, IMO, already obey the insurance company rules.

        I do not think, any longer, the US will go for what should be Medicaid for All, because our government has been totally corrupted beyond what a few well-meaning politicians may try to do.  Although this will not be reflected in campaign pandering, of course.  M4A is now just another campaign tool.  @hasslecat

        America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

        "Sometimes when I try to understand a person's motives, I play a little game. I assume the worst. What's the worst reason they could possibly have for saying what they say and doing what they do? Then I ask myself, 'How well does that reason explain what they say and what they do?'" GRRM

        A YouTube comment – we need new conspiracy theories – the old ones have all come true.

        • #492174
          Cold Mountain Trail
          Participant
          • Total Posts: 13,289

          “I feel as if Medicare recipients have gone from being sort of a captive medical demographic to just little profit centers, really.”

          I think that’s very true, and that the purpose is that, and also to bankrupt the baby boomers, and to steal genetic and other information for further for-profit escapades from big pharma.

          One of my uncles outlived all his brothers/sisters-in law.  He never went to the doctor.

          I follow his example as best I can and so far I am pill-free but for baby aspirin when needed and a multivitamin.   Knock wood.

          • #492182
            djean111
            Participant
            • Total Posts: 8,808

            and was sure I just did not remember or something.  Worst doctor visit ever, and I dumped her the next day.  Irony abounded – she was angry that I had no diseases to “manage”, but then told me that since I am 76, they won’t bother spending money to test me for anything at all.  I smell the stink of Zeke Emanuel, who says there should be no life-saving measures given after the age of 75.  I need to find a doctor not on  Direct Contract next year.  I have a knee that needs fixing, due to an old arthroscopic operation.

            America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

            "Sometimes when I try to understand a person's motives, I play a little game. I assume the worst. What's the worst reason they could possibly have for saying what they say and doing what they do? Then I ask myself, 'How well does that reason explain what they say and what they do?'" GRRM

            A YouTube comment – we need new conspiracy theories – the old ones have all come true.

            • #492183
              retired liberal
              Participant
              • Total Posts: 5,107

              Some of us are healthy enough to possibly live another 10 to 15 years past that.

              We are an arrogant species, believing our fantasy based "facts" are better than the other person's fake facts.
              If Row vs. Wade is overturned, women could lose the right to not get pregnant in 26 states.
              The Republicans are four year olds. The Democrats are six year olds. There are no grownups.
              Normalizing insanity has been the conservative's sweet spot at very least since the beginning..

              • #492185
                Cold Mountain Trail
                Participant
                • Total Posts: 13,289

                He’s 64 now, and whaddaya wanna bet he’ll be around past 80?

                Those people get excellent care to extend their healthy lifespan — not just doctoring but life supports generally — access to food, housing, services, advice, and of course, money & power.

                He just doesn’t think people outside his class are worth the cost.

              • #492186
                djean111
                Participant
                • Total Posts: 8,808

                Zeke believes no one is “productive” after 75.  And even if productive, folks over 75 are not as perky, so they are a drag on the rest of their family.  Serious as fuck here.  You do not want to be in a Zeke-controlled triage situation if you are over 75.  Google Zeke Emanuel 75 – he even resented his brain surgeon dad getting cancer surgery after 75.  I figure I have maybe 14 years left – my aunt died at 90, and my dad only died at 81 because he was given morphine after an operation, which evidently is a genetic thing in my family.  I still have years and years of sarcasm left!!!!  And music and art, etc.

                Zeke is one of Biden’s Covid advisors….


                @coldmountaintrail

                https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2019/08/26/ezekiel-emmanuel

                …..

                Emanuel acknowledged that some people will be mentally capable and active past 75. “[T]here are outliers,” he said. “There are not that many people who continue to be active and engaged and actually creative past 75. It’s a very small number.”

                Even those who do live beyond 75 aren’t actually doing anything “meaningful” with their lives, Emanuel said.

                “These people who live a vigorous life to 70, 80, 90 years of age—when I look at what those people ‘do,’ almost all of it is what I classify as play. It’s not meaningful work,” he said. “They’re riding motorcycles; they’re hiking. Which can all have value—don’t get me wrong. But if it’s the main thing in your life? Ummm, that’s not probably a meaningful life.”

                Advisor to Obama, too.  Those Emanuel brothers, they sure are rascals!

                 

                America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

                "Sometimes when I try to understand a person's motives, I play a little game. I assume the worst. What's the worst reason they could possibly have for saying what they say and doing what they do? Then I ask myself, 'How well does that reason explain what they say and what they do?'" GRRM

                A YouTube comment – we need new conspiracy theories – the old ones have all come true.

                • #492221
                  Pam2
                  Participant
                  • Total Posts: 10,948

                  @djean111

                  So according to Zeke, being a tool of the oligarchs is the only “meaningful” life?

                   

                   

                  • #492223
                    djean111
                    Participant
                    • Total Posts: 8,808

                    And even then, after 75, you just are not fun any more.

                    America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

                    "Sometimes when I try to understand a person's motives, I play a little game. I assume the worst. What's the worst reason they could possibly have for saying what they say and doing what they do? Then I ask myself, 'How well does that reason explain what they say and what they do?'" GRRM

                    A YouTube comment – we need new conspiracy theories – the old ones have all come true.

                    • #492226
                      Pam2
                      Participant
                      • Total Posts: 10,948
                      • #492235
                        djean111
                        Participant
                        • Total Posts: 8,808

                        An opportunity.

                        America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

                        "Sometimes when I try to understand a person's motives, I play a little game. I assume the worst. What's the worst reason they could possibly have for saying what they say and doing what they do? Then I ask myself, 'How well does that reason explain what they say and what they do?'" GRRM

                        A YouTube comment – we need new conspiracy theories – the old ones have all come true.

            • #492184
              Cold Mountain Trail
              Participant
              • Total Posts: 13,289

              I’m not against doctors or doctoring to the extent my uncle was.  Some things they really come in handy for, like knee surgeries.   And routine tests can save your life if you get them on time.

              So good luck finding a better one than that person.

              Just saying, I try to stay away from pharma meds, stay healthy, and stay at normal weight.

              I know some folks who just mindlessly take or do whatever their docs say, and sometimes that’s not the best thing.

              Also some folks who buy into every medical fable coming down the pike (like the one about depression being caused by ‘brain chemistry,’ a fable that you don’t hear much about any more, with good reason, which is that it’s horseshit and alway was — but it sold a lot of drugs and duped a lot of people and still does. )

    • #492188
      doh1304
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,905

      I was forced to retire in 2003 or 4 due to crisis level blood pressure. I lived off savings for a few years until I was able to go on CA’s version of M4A (MediCal, aka Medicaid) then, in 2018 I made the mistake of applying for Medicare after a Parkinson’s diagnosis. This forced me to lose MediCal for Medicare, which is seriously inferior. The basic way Medicare is inferior is that I am forced to rely on part D  – and therefore CVS rather than any pharmacy. I spend roughly $3000 a year on meds and every time I need a refill I have to fight my way past 5 minutes of CVS’s automated demands to schedule me for a covid vaccination. (“I want to refill my isosorbide.” “You want a vaccination, right?” “Isosorbide.” “Vaccination?” “ISOSORBIDE!” “Vaccination.” “Speak to the pharmacist.” “Vaccination.” “PHARMACIST!” “Please wait while I connect you to the pharmacist. You can schedule a covid vaccination through our web site at…” The time I ordered a refill through the web site it sent the wrong drug to San Jose.  After this post I’m going to the pharmacy to put the refill order in person.)

      If that isn’t bad enough come October I’ll get 5 phone calls a day demanding I buy a Medicare Advantage policy. The Biden administration is taking the money needed by Medicare and upping the subsidies to Obamacare, but I’m afraid I won’t be able to convince an insurance company doctor to accept 8 BP prescriptions – if not several cardiologists say my life expectancy will be, “How did you live long enough to ask?” (the only reason I’ve survived this long is because of a county clinic which I qualified for because I was uninsured and they kept me after I went on Medicare)

      • #492190
        djean111
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 8,808

        This is how to do that –

        https://www.goodrx.com/insurance-and-goodrx

         

        America is not a country, it's just a business. (Brad Pitt, Killing Them Softly)

        "Sometimes when I try to understand a person's motives, I play a little game. I assume the worst. What's the worst reason they could possibly have for saying what they say and doing what they do? Then I ask myself, 'How well does that reason explain what they say and what they do?'" GRRM

        A YouTube comment – we need new conspiracy theories – the old ones have all come true.

    • #492224
      Babel 17
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 6,822

      So I could order Vitamins C and D, and the mineral Zinc, from my drugstore of choice and have them delivered to me. Vitamin D deficiencies were shown to have a correlation with worse outcomes from the COVID-19 pandemic.

      Zinc is generally highly regarded as being useful to have in your body to deal with viruses.

      Don't Kill the Whale
      Don't feed the trolls

    • #492241
      rudycantfail
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 374
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