Nearly 1,900 Washington state workers quit or are fired over COVID vaccine mandate

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    • #450524
      ZimInSeattle
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,461

      OLYMPIA — About 3% of the 63,000 Washington state workers subject to Gov. Jay Inslee’s COVID-19 vaccine mandate have left their jobs or were terminated as this week’s deadline passed.

      So far, 1,887 state employees were terminated or left their positions over the mandate that they be fully vaccinated by Oct. 18 or lose their jobs, according to the Office of Financial Management.

      Another roughly 3%, or 1,927 workers, received an accommodation that allows them to work in a less-public role without being vaccinated.

      An additional 4.6% of state workers — nearly 2,900 — are still in a state of flux, according to a statement by OFM Tuesday afternoon.

      More: https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/nearly-1900-washington-state-workers-quit-or-are-fired-over-covid-vaccine-mandate/#comments

      "Poverty is the parent of revolution and crime" - Aristotle "The more I see of the moneyed peoples, the more I understand the guillotine" - George Bernard Shaw "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, will make violent revolution inevitable" - JFK "If wars can be started by lies, they can be stopped by truth." ~ Julian Assange #SurviveAndRevolt

    • #450525
      ZimInSeattle
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,461

      Big Pharma thanks all those selfish un-vacinnated folks for their fealty to corporate profits and not to their fellow citizens. Virus will continue to mutate amongst the un-vaccinated and this thing will go on & on forever. There is no valid political or religious argument for not taking the vaccine. If you lose your job because you are too hard headed, I hear they are hiring at the hospitals where all the un-vaccinated COVID patients are showing up. Oh, wait, you have to be vaccinated to work in healthcare. Maybe you all should move to Texas where you are free to be un-vaccinated and you can experience real government over reach when you need an abortion. “The modern conservative is engaged in one of man’s oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness” – John Kenneth Galbraith

      Covid in some variation is likely to always be here and getting Covid vaccines and boosters will be as common as getting flu shots. As common as our children being vaccinated against polio, measles, chicken pox and other illnesses most people don’t suffer from anymore thanks to vaccines. Those foolish enough to ‘take a stand’ and quit their jobs over a Covid vaccine already look ignorant. That’s a look that isn’t going to wear well for them over the next decade. Assuming they live to see it.

      "Poverty is the parent of revolution and crime" - Aristotle "The more I see of the moneyed peoples, the more I understand the guillotine" - George Bernard Shaw "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, will make violent revolution inevitable" - JFK "If wars can be started by lies, they can be stopped by truth." ~ Julian Assange #SurviveAndRevolt

    • #450534
      HassleCat
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 8,339

      if they get the jab.

    • #450539
      Pam2
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 9,845

      How are they planning to replace these people? Are testing and PPE an option for the unvaxxed? If that was working last year, why not now?

    • #450544
      MackMarkstein
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 386

      Doesn’t even the CDC admit that these “vaccines” don’t stop transmission of Covid 19? And don’t stop vaxed people from being quite contagious? while being asymptomatic?
      Funniest comment that I’ve yet read on the topic, but it makes its point. I’ll even include the right-wingish Trump-tribute phrase “Chinese virus” that the author of this brief comment used: He or she was probably actually a Trump fan, but this made me laugh out loud anyway, good comment:

      “So the Chinese virus only harms you if you get it from an unvaccinated person? “

      • #450547
        Pam2
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 9,845

        @mackmarkstein

        Not only that, but the mandates aren’t working if people are willing to lose their jobs instead of getting vaxxed! It’s a failure. Go back to what worked last year when everybody was unvaxxed. (hygiene, testing, masks etc.)

         

         

      • #450587
        So Far From Heaven
        Keymaster
        • Total Posts: 9,880

        This isn’t about any of that, now is it?

        This is about transmission and effect after being exposed, now isn’t THAT true?

        You need to look up how vaccination reduces effects. Then, you need to look at how many are dying because the anti-vax IDIOTS get sick and use up all the available resources, insuring that those needing them for other emergency reasons wait in the hall or ambulance and die.

        Most selfish stance ever is to not get vaccinated.

    • #450556
      salemcourt
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 3,119

      Then zero % hospitalizations.  Therefore, for all vaccinated people, there should be no need for masks or lockdowns.

    • #450564
      jbnw
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 7,432

      One is a cancer survivor and had (I think) the Moderna vaccine – she had a high fever and was in bed for several days.
      Another had the Pfizer vaccine, and his doctor sent him to the emergency room to deal with symptoms a few hours later.
      The third had the Johnson and Johnson vaccine, and had the weirdest symptom – anything she ate tasted disgusting and couldn’t be kept down. She was unable to eat for several days.

      The friend who had the J&J was forced to have it to keep her job in an Oregon healthcare setting. If she has to take a second shot, now recommended for J&J, she won’t, after that experience. She would quit first.

      My own reactions were mild to Pfizer, but it was still two days off work. I have never had any reaction to other vaccines, and yes, I get them when medically recommended, including the flu vaccine.

      I am very definitely in the camp of make the vaccines a matter of choice rather than this draconian authoritative approach, world-wide, of get vaccinated or we’ll make you life miserable and expensive by having to pay for two tests a week to continue basic activities of daily living.

      Especially because this vaccine is not like the polio vaccine – it doesn’t prevent it.

    • #450566
      MackMarkstein
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 386

      Maybe.

      I’m hearing too much of the “99.999% of people in hospitals with Covid are unvaxed”  or numbers of that “well, duh!”  calibre.

      Please, somebody who believes that cite a source.

      The sources I’ve looked at very closely, late nights, are (coincidentally) not from the USA, are from places like the UK and even Israel where they might be more honest about stats.  They do seem to show a certain percentage reduction in hospitalizations and deaths among the vaxed vs. unvaxed.  Nothing hugely dramatic like the memes that are being quoted so often.  Also, the data is muddy.  There are still too many variables, even in UK and Israeli studies, though probably in CDC studies there is both too many variables plus fictionalization.

      Meanwhile:  the vaxes developed for this coronavirus are truly scary and not good for those who do have the side effects (one possible one being death). And a mandate or vax passport to protect the vaxed from the unvaxed has become a lie (if it ever wasn’t)…because the vaxes do not prevent, or apparently even reduce the probability measurably, of transmission or being contagious.

       

    • #450573
      jbnw
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 7,432

      • #450592
        So Far From Heaven
        Keymaster
        • Total Posts: 9,880

        Testing positive isn’t the same as being critical in the hospital, is it?

        The only numbers that count are those regarding how bad it gets (the effects of COVID) and who dies from it.

        I assure you that set of numbers isn’t what that tweet was about.

        • #450599
          jbnw
          Participant
          • Total Posts: 7,432

          Small example from the CDC:

          Among five COVID-19 patients who were hospitalized, four were fully vaccinated; no deaths were reported.

          Details:

          During July 2021, 469 cases of COVID-19 associated with multiple summer events and large public gatherings in a town in Barnstable County, Massachusetts, were identified among Massachusetts residents; vaccination coverage among eligible Massachusetts residents was 69%. Approximately three quarters (346; 74%) of cases occurred in fully vaccinated persons (those who had completed a 2-dose course of mRNA vaccine [Pfizer-BioNTech or Moderna] or had received a single dose of Janssen [Johnson & Johnson] vaccine ≥14 days before exposure). Genomic sequencing of specimens from 133 patients identified the B.1.617.2 (Delta) variant of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, in 119 (89%) and the Delta AY.3 sublineage in one (1%). Overall, 274 (79%) vaccinated patients with breakthrough infection were symptomatic. Among five COVID-19 patients who were hospitalized, four were fully vaccinated; no deaths were reported.

          https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7031e2.htm

          It’s hard to find that unvaccinated / vaccinated hospitalization statistic.

          • #450603
            So Far From Heaven
            Keymaster
            • Total Posts: 9,880

            are those that give a breakdown of severity versus vaccination status.

            Every last one I’ve seen show a huge disparity of severity between the two.

            Why does that matter?

            We just got Crisis Code for our state again, two days ago.

            Check this little tid bit out: 2 ICU beds in the entire state available.

            How many are going to die because non-vaccine fools keep taking all the resources?

            • #450605
              jbnw
              Participant
              • Total Posts: 7,432

              I have friends of friends who have died from coronavirus.

              I have friends who have been really sick from the vaccine.

              I have friends of friends who have gotten coronavirus after being fully vaccinated.

              I have a friend of a friend who died after taking the vaccine.

              I have friends who have recovered from coronavirus without hospitalization, and a couple who probably have long COVID from early days of coronavirus when tests weren’t easily available (including me).

              I have friends who have been fine so far without vaccinations, and who have been fine with the vaccinations.

              And I don’t know how much those in the hospitals for coronavirus will have to pay, and I haven’t heard that discussion anywhere.

              • #450606
                So Far From Heaven
                Keymaster
                • Total Posts: 9,880

                Where are the discussions on Universal Health Care right now, huh???????

                Talk about the perfect time and no discussions.

                Where the hell are all the progressives these days?

              • #450649
                MackMarkstein
                Participant
                • Total Posts: 386

                I think the first-hand report, or close to it, in this thread, of hospitals being close to full is from New Mexico.

                I don’t doubt any of those reports (that come from someone close to the ground, not the AP or CDC).  But I have a friend/coworker whose daughter is a nurse in Illinois and he reports that hospitals have no such problems around the areas she works.  Thus that’s more reason for that Dad and daughter to think that reports from The Media are from somebody’s exaggeration machine.

                Around Eastern Missouri/Western Illinois, the latest wave, including hospitalization, was scary for a while and was similar to January 2021.  But it’s clearly on its way down.  This despite the vax rate being stalled out and still at about 50%.  One thing that’s for real though is those who’ve had the disease  and survived have developed a type of immunity, for longer than the “vaxes” could grant it.  So that’s one thing probably reducing the plague numbers in MO/IL.  Meanwhile same stats getting worse, getting to crest of a wave in places like Vermont!!  Where the vax rate is a lot higher than Mo./Illinois (around 70% in Vermont).

                Edited to add some actual numbers reported by the hospital system in St. Louis:  A far cry from New Mexico or anywhere that is hurting for hospital capacity.  The occupancy has dropped significantly since peak of Delta which I think was Aug. in the MO/IL  area.  As mentioned, hard to imagine the miracle products from Pfizer/Moderna/JJ did that, being as half the population here avoids *them* like the plague.

                “ICU Occupancy ●
                According to data released by the Pandemic Task force, 110 intensive care unit (ICU) beds at
                SSM, BJC, Mercy, and St. Luke’s hospitals in the St. Louis metro area were occupied by
                confirmed or suspected COVID-19 patients as of 10/11 – 12.6 percent of total ICU capacity,
                assuming a total capacity of 871 ICU beds.”

    • #450580
      Hobbit709
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,757

      And that is the “official” number. The real death toll is statistically likely to be 50% higher.

      You don’t want to get the shot, then stay the fuck home.

      My niece, an ICU RN in OH says 100% of the people on ventilators in her hospital are not vaccinated. And she’s about ready to use the clue by four on the refusers. She’s tired of 12-16 hour shifts

      I don't waste my time teaching pigs to sing.

    • #450608
      jerry611
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,338

      Big Pharma and the dozen people who have become new billionaires because of the vaccine thanks you for your mandates. All for a vaccine that doesn’t stop you from getting sick and doesn’t stop you from spreading it.

      Also lets keep it in perspective. I am sick and tired of this being compared to some catastrophic disease. COVID-19 is not Ebola (70% mortality). It’s not Polio (20% mortality). It’s not smallpox (30% mortality). Stop it! COVID-19 has a mortality rate of 1.5%. The vast majority of people who contract it will defeat the virus without any medical assistance. If you are young, healthy, and already had the virus and defeated it, what good is the vaccine going to do you? Will it stop you from getting re-infected? No. Will it stop you from spreading it to someone else? No. So what the hell is the point??? Why is previous infection being completely ignored? Why is their such a god damn obsession in getting this vaccine forcefully injected into everyone’s arm?

      And here’s the real kicker… the damn thing doesn’t even last! You will have to get infinite boosters. And Big Pharma makes infinite profits. Get the Polio shot…you are immune. Get the Measles shot…you are immune. Get the Chicken Pox shot….you are immune. Get the COVID shot….keep wearing your mask and see ya in a few months for your next booster! Sorry….but these COVID vaccines suck!

      • #450731
        So Far From Heaven
        Keymaster
        • Total Posts: 9,880

        if you need an emergency room and ICU FOR ANYTHING and this type of shit is still going down because of stances like this, then you may have a big surprise in store.

        IF you live thru it, come back and tell me about it like this again.

    • #450609
      Snort McDork
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 5,209

      You can include the head coach of WSU (Washington State University) who was canned for refusing the jab.

      I'm Snort McDork and I approved this message.

      "I like Birdy Num-Nums"

      If you come for Nina Turner, Your ish better be airtight like Tupperware" -Rashida Talib

    • #450683
      A Simple Game
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,211

      How many were going to retire anyway?  3% sounds like it’s probably the normal attrition rate for retirement.  Quit or get fired so you can be part of any lawsuit settlement and draw the retirement you were already planning on.  Not sure if that would work if you are fired?

    • #450685
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103

    • #450686
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103
    • #450687
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103

      Robert E Most, MD (@LNeuroscientist) Tweeted:
      What good is it to have 3x, 10x the immune memory for the alpha-strain when the virus you’re gonna get is Delta+kappa-mu-gamma-Ida? The vaccines are failing because they are non-sterilizing
      They push evolution of the variants
      That extra immune glop at best increases inflammation> https://twitter.com/LNeuroscientist/status/1434208164161916929?s=20

    • #450688
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103

       

      a (@bH2Omiamigo) Tweeted:
      @angelaronnette @RWMaloneMD There’s that pathway again.
      Yet no one wants to discuss it.
      Weird.

      @gutwat1 @WorldEdgeDG @KathMLee1 @Ducky68257909 @villagerssn https://t.co/5pW3D2Q6W9 https://twitter.com/bH2Omiamigo/status/1446461904491253779?s=20

    • #450689
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103

    • #450690
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103

      DrKAT (@KathMLee1) Tweeted:
      These injections do not prevent infection, do not prevent transmission, and do not prevent death. This doesn’t stop at 1,2,3,4, or 5 shots. Ask yourself, where does this actually end? https://twitter.com/KathMLee1/status/1450875410321854466?s=20

    • #450692
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103

      Walter M Chesnut (@Parsifaler) Tweeted:
      1) A FIBROUS DISEASE: IRON HOMEOSTASIS, ANTHRACOSIS, ASBESTOS AND THE SPIKE PROTEIN
      DO SPIKE PROTEIN THERAPIES INDUCE SYSTEMIC FIBROSIS BY “SIMPLY” AVOIDING THE “BOTHER” OF A “RESPIRATORY” INFECTION?
      First: The word “asbestos”, first used in the 1600s, ultimately derives from https://t.co/9JJFVig2ki https://twitter.com/Parsifaler/status/1451011684664025089?s=20

    • #450696
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103
    • #450698
      lownslow
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,103

      Prof Norman Fenton (@profnfenton) Tweeted:
      1/8 We’ve argued before why it’s crucial to compare all-cause mortality rates for vaccinated v unvaccinated by each age category. We’ve just produced a new paper (led by .@MartinNeil9) looking at the available data on this … https://t.co/lBSEMqAlap https://twitter.com/profnfenton/status/1451159772678561796?s=20

    • #450703
      retired liberal
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 4,634

      In no particular order:
      The three COVID vaccines are different. Pfizer is the weakest, least effective.
      The Moderna vaccine is approximately 3 times stronger than the Pfizer. Both are mRNA vaccines. The Mederna and the Pfizer vaccines have different formulas.
      The Johnson & Johnson vaccine is a standard DNA vaccine.
      All three vaccines are being lumped together as being somehow the same. The are not. Which vaccine you get matters. Which vaccine did the vaccinated sick/hospitalized people get?
      What is totally missing is, were they wearing masks, when in crowds, sports events, bars, parties, etc.? Did they “Social Distance”, or at least try as a normal thing?
      Proper mask wearing will go a long way toward reducing this pandemic. Your nose is connected to your lungs also. Keep it
      covered when wearing a mask.
      With 751,815 dead and counting, as of today, COVID-19 and its variants are not the common cold, or the flu. It is not just the elderly dying, either.

      We are an arrogant species, believing our fantasy based "facts" are better than the other person's fake facts.
      The older we get, the less "Life in Prison" is a deterrent.
      Don't forget that the S in IoT stands for Security.
      Beware of geeks bearing GIFs.

      • #450912
        salemcourt
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 3,119

        why not just stick to masks alone.  Conversely, if the vaccinations prevent you from catching Covid, then why the mask after you get vaccinated?

        • #450945
          retired liberal
          Participant
          • Total Posts: 4,634

          The masks lessen the viral load if you do get infected. How heavy the viral load is, is important in how sick you get, if infected. That is why being in crowds is a bad idea, especially inside. And why social distancing is a good idea.

          We are an arrogant species, believing our fantasy based "facts" are better than the other person's fake facts.
          The older we get, the less "Life in Prison" is a deterrent.
          Don't forget that the S in IoT stands for Security.
          Beware of geeks bearing GIFs.

    • #450714
      Hobbit709
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,757
    • #450717
      MackMarkstein
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 386

      The “vaxes” are much, much risker than people were led to believe, or still are, by the media.  The vaxes themselves can hurt or kill you:  The Pfizer, the Moderna, and the J and J:  and some of the individual risks of each are discussed to the extent there is data,  but you’d have to dig through Twitter feeds or anything-but-Google.

      Many of those resisting their mandate and fired:  did so for that reason.  It’s at least a 200-pound elephant in the room (mixing metaphors to try to add even a little levity).

    • #450736
      sadoldgirl
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,510

      It is understandable that the government and a lot of its

      believers want this mandate. The fact is that it won’t work

      in the long run. Instead it creates resistance and division; as

      if we did not have enough of this. Divide et empera.

      This is not only true for the US, just look around the world.

      The virus will stay here, and it will continue to mutate. Until

      most of us had the Covid infection and thereby natural

      immunity there will be no herd immunity. The vaccines are

      concentrating on only ONE viral protein, which in several

      breakthrough cases prove to be insufficient. The real problem

      was created by the government in two ways:

      a) There was no admission of ignorance and a huge amount of

      mixed and confusing messages.

      b) The government exempted Big Pharma from all liability. That

      means that those, who could prove damage from the vaccine,

      had/have no legal recourse. That should make a lot of us very

      careful.

      Lastly I don’t believe the media  or the government anymore in

      many cases (domestic or foreign policies). Then why should I trust

      them now in this case? Thus, while I took the J&J vaccine, I don’t

      blame anyone for choosing not to do so. Those taking the vaccine

      take a risk and so do those who don’t.

      • #450755
        HassleCat
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 8,339

        You express an idea I hear often. The vaccine will not work because variants crop up, but we will achieve herd immunity when enough of us get covid and recover. I don’t think there is any evidence of this, in spite of claims that natural immunity is better than vaccined immunity. It is very possible, although not necessarily true, that covid will behave much like influenza, with a partially effective vaccine every year and limited natural immunity. If that turns out to be the case, this virus will be with us for many years to come, perhaps forever. The reason these unsupported ideas proliferate is because so many people choose a side and become heavily invested in being right. They sieze on almost any piece of information and interpret it to support their emotional position. This is why we have pro-vaxxers and anti-vaxxers lined up against each other, flooding the interwebs with whatever they find to make themselves appear right and the other side appear foolish. This is completely unhelpful for the huge majority stuck in the middle, willing to do whatever it takes to address the pandemic. Personally, I am willing to get a vaccine, a booster, a preventive pill, even an experiemental off-label magic elixer, if I think it will do any good. I am willing to accept a certain amount of risk associated with each of these alternatives because it is my civic duty to contribute whatever I can to the solution, not just for me, but for my fellow humans as well. I am not willing to volunteer to get covid because there is a significant chance I would die. Short of that, sign me up.

        • #450913
          salemcourt
          Participant
          • Total Posts: 3,119

          kids under 4 being focibily masked

           

          • #450950
            HassleCat
            Participant
            • Total Posts: 8,339

            Kids should wear masks in public, regardless of age. If they are too young, too restless, hyperactive, etc. then mom & dad have to be careful about limiting their contact with other people. I see toddlers at WalMart wearing masks & they seem happy as clams. Other kids might not be able to handle it, even at six or seven years old.

    • #450775
      doh1304
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,787

      For myself, I don’t have a dog in this fight. I haven’t been sick for more than a few hours in thirty years. I got fully vaxxed for social reasons (I don’t want to scare friends. Same for masks, Don’t want the arguments and the fear)

      But as far as “the science” is concerned this is the latest I’ve heard: (and it changes daily)

      The vaccines were designed not to prevent transmission, then they were guaranteed to stop transmission, then they were worthless against transmission again.

      The vaxxes are claimed to reduce the likelyhood of hospitalization and death, but the “overwhelming” factor is comorbidities – age, obesity, diabetes, etc.  and the comorbidities stack. There is a recent study (Harvard) that claims no relation between vaccination and hospitalizations. (note: in the UK every death of an infected person has been reported as a “covid death”) Another study (don’t remember the source but I got it from dr. Campbell, who only uses highly reliable sources) says somewhere around four fifths of covid deaths would have died within a month from some other reason anyway, making death tallies highly unreliable.

      mRNA vaccines have been linked to heart inflammation in young males, but  while at least 5 nations have blocked vaccinations for males under 18 in America states are mandating vaccinations for all children.

      Merck has claimed that its “game changer” drug is safe for pregnant women, but in its clinical trial pregnant women were barred and subjects were required to refrain from sex. Also, in its press release Merck claims that its drug is (almost) as good as IVM (which Merck no longer makes) for only 1500 times the price. Incidentally, India reports an approximately 90% decrease in “cases” (hospitalizations?) since initiating a policy of distributing free IVM.

      New Zealand has had the best or almost the best luck against covid by essentially taking absolute measures. Australia has had similar results, but that has broken. Opinion: Absolutism has to be absolute.

      Opinion: Our experts do not have faith in the public. They are constantly making pronouncements based on incomplete information and quickly having to contradict them. They make overly positive claims because people don’t believe them, only reinforcing that distrust as their claims prove false. They get defensive and double down on claims they know they cannot produce. This only makes matters worse.

      That or the drug companies have crossed he line into genocide for profit.

    • #451032
      ronRonnie1
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 395

      I don’t care what anyone says.  If you catch Covid, you’re more likely to die/get really sick if you’re unvaccinated as opposed to vaccinated.   They can go find a job that doesn’t require a vaccine.  My patience ran out LONG ago.

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