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Home Main Forums General Discussion So here we go again.

  • davidthegnome (1198 posts)
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    So here we go again.

    It has been almost twenty years now since Bush “won” (said with heavy sarcasm) the 2000 election.  The results were catastrophic.  For our economy, for our foreign relations, for our poor, for pretty much anyone in need anywhere in the US.  On top of National and international embarrassment, the (millionaire) late night comedians had a blast mocking him.  War based on lies – lies that were told to the whole international community.  The risk of the complete collapse of the world’s economy that inspired bailouts for big financial institutions – that, today, are practicing much the same habits they practiced prior to it.

    What is the difference between now and then?  Well, chief among them is that we have a President and administration that is even worse – with a House and Senate that may make a pretense at resistance to some of Trump’s more insane ideas – but is nonetheless also far worse than that of the Bush years.  Apparently, the tax cuts for the wealthy during the Bush years didn’t teach the voters very much.  In fact, the power of the far right and the enablers of the 1% seems to be increasing dramatically.  We are constantly getting more stories of rich douche bags getting away with rape, murder, war crimes, the list is pretty much endless.

    There has, perhaps, been some evolution in many of us rejecting corporate democrats, but rather than this inspiring genuine change in a progressive direction, our Nation’s voters and elected officials have lost their collective fucking mind.  There is talk of eliminating the education department, the environmental protection agency, eliminating the estate tax to help out those suffering Waltons and Trumps.  Whether any of this comes to pass or not, among the issues is that we have a media that does not consist of journalism or genuine reporting.

    Do any of you remember the old TNT ads?  “We know drama!”  Indeed, this ought to be the new motto of the American media.  Whether MSNBC, Fox, CNN, or whatever flavor of corporate “journalism” we may favor, many real issues, much genuine news and reality itself is conveniently ignored for the sake of entertainment.  It is convenient, because, let’s face it, we have way too many people who are too ignorant to even comprehend any of the issues of the day.  Thanks in part to the media’s gradual dumbing down of the American populace, all the rage is… “what kind of sandwich does Obama like?”  Or Trump’s latest bit of political idiocy.  In a time when our safety net faces potential devastation.

    Where I live, in Maine, over 90% of those living in Nursing homes are covered by Medicaid.  There are proposals in place today, that if passed through the house and Senate would throw these people out on the street.  There are very deliberate attempts in play to de-fund and destroy any positive legislation or efforts to aid the poor.  It seems that some will not be pleased until the poor simply die off.  One of the worst kept secrets on earth?  Our media members are generally among those 1%, or at the very least among their enablers.  It was their nonstop coverage that, to begin with, enabled Trump to gain electoral victory.  Hatchet jobs on Bernie Sanders also played a part in weakening his position and strengthening Clinton’s.  Never mind that she was under investigation by the FBI, that the Clintons had a legacy of corruption and lies.

    To further injure… there have been many lives lost – and hundreds of billions of dollars in damage caused to various parts of our Nation.  Puerto Rico is without power, adequate food and water.  Yet, nonetheless, the stories of the day are about Weinstein and Trump, Obama and Clinton.  The gap between the rich and poor is widening as we speak, every day.  If the current administration can accomplish the ultra conservative’s wet dream of massive tax cuts for the rich and the elimination of social programs… will we learn anything?  Will the media change?  Will our politicians develop integrity?  Will our people suddenly gain the knowledge necessary to cast an educated vote?

    I’m going to say it:  NO.  From Bush to Trump, what seems to have been best learned is how to distract and disable the populace.  How to not let the right hand know what the left is doing, or vice versa, as the case may be.

    Are our memories truly so short?  Is there really not a damn thing that can be done to stop this moronic chain of events?  We may have stopped (temporarily) the repeal of the ACA and the disastrous healthcare bill brought forth by idiots, but there will be more to come.  Eventually, what seems most likely is that the democrats will give the conservatives half of what they want and call it a compromise – when what is actually necessary is the exact opposite of what is happening.

    Will we ever wake up?

    hopemountain, As Seen on the Internet, Koko and 32 othersshanti, VagrantPeters, dlegendary1, mmonk, RealityCheck, slay, TRex, chknltl, Satan, bbgrunt, virgdem, canoeist52, disillusioned73, Enthusiast, h-32, BuySellTrade, ctsnowman, Utopian Leftist, B Calm, Xyzse, Lorien, PADemD, Jefferson23, Ichingcarpenter, Scuba, Fuddnik, nevereVereven, Phlem, N2Doc, ravensong, ThouArtThat, WillyT like this
    “There is no distinctly native American criminal class save Congress.” - Mark Twain

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    • ThouArtThat (5799 posts)
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      1. The First Question This Citizen Asks Others When Discussing Current Affairs Is

      “What is the purpose of society?”

      If the other person is unable to articulate a competent answer, this citizen suggests that the purpose of a society is

      “to nurture and support all citizens within the society, not just the millionaires and billionaires”.

      If the other person balks, this citizen suggests that they ponder the question until a civil discussion can occur.

       

      "In America Today, Power Corrupts and Money Corrupts Absolutely" - Anonymous  
      • Utopian Leftist (513 posts)
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        12. Interesting.

        I’ll have to try that approach. I have, sadly, given up on speaking to Republicans.

        I have one deal-breaker for dates: I refuse to date a RepubliCON, a NEOLIBERAL or anyone who is not politically “woke,” for that matter, and I’m not trying to be hip by using that word–I think that if we don’t wake up now and demand that there be CLASS WARFARE, then we’re going to lose what little is left of the safety net. It’s sad that so many of the people, like myself, who rely on some form of government assistance (literally half the country, now) don’t vote.

        I blame the media for selling lifestyles that invariably center around the True God that our current society worships: MONEY. While half the country is forced to work two jobs in order to do more than survive, most of the other half are oblivious to the ominously encroaching poverty that is seeping through every crack. They are sidetracked and preoccupied with the Cult of Personality, hoping for a hero to lead them, fascinated with the latest gadget and immune to real human sympathy (though they love to throw a very tiny portion of their estate at others, less-fortunate, once in a while, just to remind themselves of their smug superiority and they will likely cry when XYZ Kartrashian has his/her inevitable breakdown).

        They don’t know that their own ignorance encourages great evil. They can vote for a lumbering oaf, such as the D-Rump, or a fake-ass, venemously-opportunistic money-grubber like $hitlery, without once thinking of the millions who will die and the millions more who will suffer, as a result. They are priviledged enough that they will not, personally, be much affected by the economy, no matter who becomes President. And then there is that portion that are not merely ignorant: the sadistic sort who enjoy watching our beautiful nation being destroyed from within. Sadly, they are winning at the moment.

        The beatdown Hillary was handed had nothing to do with Bernie Bros, Russia, a VRWC, Comey, the FBI, the media, sexism, racism or any other ism you can think of. It was a referendum on neoliberalism. It is your legacy, Obama. It’s Clinton fatigue born of endless scandals. It’s war and prison for profit. It’s criminality that dresses itself up like saintliness and looks down its nose at its victims. ~ farleftlib
        • Coldmountaintrail (3690 posts)
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          13. "They are sidetracked and preoccupied with the Cult of Personality…"

          Maybe some, bit I think more are just fine because they still believe that struggling people are struggling because:

          1.  They’re uneducated/skillless
          2. They’re drug-addicted/alcoholic etc.
          3. They’re lazy and don’t want to work
          4. They have mental problems

          At any rate, they’re losers and who cares so long as I’ve got mine.

          I know lots of people for whom that’s the basic thinking, however they disguise it.

          • Utopian Leftist (513 posts)
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            21. If one is not politically "woke,"

            then one is either ignorant or worse: willfully ignorant. Some of the ignorant can be educated. But I think you’re incorrect that many people actually believe those myths about poverty. In this time it is clear, and as we head towards the future, the Truth will become even more clear. But most of those people are willfully ignorant. They would rather live in misery than admit they are or have ever been wrong about anything (**cough**$hitlery**cough**).

            The beatdown Hillary was handed had nothing to do with Bernie Bros, Russia, a VRWC, Comey, the FBI, the media, sexism, racism or any other ism you can think of. It was a referendum on neoliberalism. It is your legacy, Obama. It’s Clinton fatigue born of endless scandals. It’s war and prison for profit. It’s criminality that dresses itself up like saintliness and looks down its nose at its victims. ~ farleftlib
            • Coldmountaintrail (3690 posts)
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              23. I'm sure many people don't, but they're not the 'people who matter' and

              hold the system in place.  The people who run things, who keep the wheels turning; the people the rest, for various reasons, ‘follow’ at least with lip service.  Because they have to to survive.  It’s a machine, and the levers run from the top down.

      • RealityCheck (988 posts)
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        24. to nurture and support all citizens within the society, not just millionaires ..

        Your observation is spot on. I’ll add my two cents to yours’.

        Once upon a time, our collective objective was to sustain a society that may progress and to avoid as many setbacks as possible. Deliberate setbacks would be unacceptable. What’s acceptable is a sustainable society’s that works to avoid setbacks and collapse so that humans may live as healthy and fairly as possible.

        When we speak in terms such as this, I think back to FDR and a very short lived JFK ….. sprinkled with Bill Clinton and Obama. The latter pair, unfortunately, were greatly influenced by big corporate monies as were the rest of our modern day presidents not mentioned.

      • Fasttense (1606 posts)
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        25. Hmm interesting but I think of society as a naturally occurring

        environment wherever more than 5 unrelated people congregate. It doesn’t necessarily need a purpose. Libertarians like to pretend there is no such thing as society but even stone age humanoids had a form of society; even apes and gorillas have a society.

        Now to me the question is are the people of the society going to use it to help everyone or just the few powerful. We seem to have decided that society should be used to only help the already well off. That’s what capitalism is all about. Those born with capital get to accumulate more capital. Those born without capital are prey and serfs.

        • ThouArtThat (5799 posts)
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          26. Successful Societies Have A Zeitgeist – A Anima Mundi – A Driving Force

          For America that used to be democracy with a dose of capitalism.

          Now all that America is about is greed.

          "In America Today, Power Corrupts and Money Corrupts Absolutely" - Anonymous  
          • Fasttense (1606 posts)
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            29. Seems to me mankind goes back and forth

            From putting the majority’s welfare uppermost to putting only the powerful’s welfare uppermost, though the powerful seem to get their needs taken care of more often. I see the usefulness to a society of putting the majority’s welfare first. I do not understand putting the powerful’s interest first. Societies seem to disinigrate and suffer when they put the needs of powerful first. It’s as if mankind’s social structures are suicidal.

             

    • N2Doc (5015 posts)
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      2. I despair as well

      The wave of Propaganda, coming from all angles, seems impossible to overcome. Our youth seem to be our last hope, but will they be able to keep to their principles against the tide?

      "But nothing ever changes unless there's some pain" - Tears For Fears "Goodnight Song"
      • davidthegnome (1198 posts)
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        3. Good question.

        I’m somewhere in that awkward area between the… younger youth, and the middle aged.  I am, roughly (or should be) in the prime of my life at 33.  Last night I went to a Kiwanis meeting with my Father, who joined the group at age 30 (he’s 65 now).  Their purpose generally tends to be supporting the poor, particularly poor children, through volunteering efforts, fund raising and so on.  The meeting was held at a local watering hole called the Tiki Lounge.

        Looking around, out of about 40 members, there were perhaps two adults under age 60.  There was a small group of children from a semi-local school of math and science (these kids are gifted and brilliant) who had their own club intended to raise awareness about poverty and homelessness.  What I got from it the most though, were discussions of old events, twenty or even forty years in the past.  There was discussion of efforts to increase club membership, to provide funding for a project that helps other Countries vaccinate against disease.  Good stuff, to be sure, but…

        They were either not aware, or did not care about the genuine circumstances of the day.  I had to listen to a fifteen minute speech where the “Governor” of the club got his ass kissed in a most spectacular fashion, in which the local club President went over so many accolades and past accomplishments I thought my head was going to explode.  When the Governor (not a real governor, it’s a club position) finally did speak, he went on a rant about how membership needed to be raised, that all should invite people.  It was not discussed, nor even considered that the bar in which we sat had employees living below the poverty level.  It was not considered that the people of our local community are facing harder times than ever before.  In regards to food, employment, the overwhelming epidemic of drug and alcohol addiction.

        Nope, they talked about bake sales, about cookouts, about parades… but nothing – and I mean – literally nothing – about how to help the local community, or how to really assist the poor, as their charter and mission statement suggests as their purpose.  The meeting, of course, began with a Pledge of Allegiance and a prayer from some minister or other.  Pledging our allegiance and drinking 4 dollar beer after paying our 15 dollar fee for the dinner event… struck me as kind of ridiculous.  They used to have an annual lobster and steak dinner and auction to supposedly raise funds for the poor.

        What I mostly saw was a bunch of middle and upper class white people kissing each other’s asses.  I hate to say it, because I like most of those people, they are decent, intelligent – and have genuine compassion for the poor.  What they lack is any understanding of just how desperate things have become, of what kind of effort is actually needed to make improvements.

        My Father, who’s membership lapsed several years ago (and was invited because he was a past President) tried to convince me to join.  I considered it, until the end of the night when several people asked me “what do you do?”  When I told them, they gave me looks of mild distaste mixed with pained grimaces of mock sympathy.  Until poverty hits you personally, until it hits those closest to you, you just can’t know.  I had a young life of much privilege and opportunity, but thanks to disabilities both physical and psychological, I am on the opposite end of the world from such people.  There really… isn’t much in common.

        My Father thought I could educate and inspire them – what he doesn’t get, is that they view me with contempt, because, ironically, I am among the poor and disabled that it is supposedly their mission to assist.

        As for the principles of our youth… principles are great, but don’t mean much when not combined with action.  I’d love to get a small group of people up here to come together in genuine support of poverty – particularly made up of those of us who know what it is other than as a statistic.

        Sorry for the rant, it’s been a rough lifetime.

        “There is no distinctly native American criminal class save Congress.” - Mark Twain
        • N2Doc (5015 posts)
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          4. No need to be sorry, I appreciate the reply n/t

          "But nothing ever changes unless there's some pain" - Tears For Fears "Goodnight Song"
    • ravensong (1759 posts)
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      5. "Will we ever wake up?"

      No.  At this point, not in numbers significant enough to continue progressive human evolution.

      The 1% owns and controls the factors and means of production and distribution, and the MSM.  The MSM controls the minds and belief systems of those unfortunates among us who are so lacking in cognitive and perceptual abilities that they can be easily led to act against their own interests (conservatives).  Conservatives are extremely easy for the 1% to control, and they will infinitely repeat the same mistakes while expecting different results.  The oligarchs know this and use this information to maintain their systems for profiting themselves by maintaining control of their labor farm and “herds”.

      The only way to eliminate the control that oligarchs have over people is for people to stop participating in the oligarch systems, which will never happen because of the complete control that oligarchs have over the conservative culture population group that they have created.

      “Whoever controls the media, the images, controls the culture” ~ Allen Ginsberg

      Researchers help define what makes a political conservative

      BERKELEY – Politically conservative agendas may range from supporting the Vietnam War to upholding traditional moral and religious values to opposing welfare. But are there consistent underlying motivations?

      Four researchers who culled through 50 years of research literature about the psychology of conservatism report that at the core of political conservatism is the resistance to change and a tolerance for inequality, and that some of the common psychological factors linked to political conservatism include:

      Fear and aggression
      Dogmatism and intolerance of ambiguity
      Uncertainty avoidance
      Need for cognitive closure
      Terror management
      snip—
      The avoidance of uncertainty, for example, as well as the striving for certainty, are particularly tied to one key dimension of conservative thought – the resistance to change or hanging onto the status quo, they said.

      http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/07/22_politics.shtml

      I’m afraid that the best we can do is to (sometimes) keep conservatives in check in order to prevent them from causing catastrophic widespread misery, destruction, and death.

      Together, together, my friends, we have begun a political revolution to transform America, and that revolution, our revolution, continues. ~ Bernie
      • davidthegnome (1198 posts)
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        7. As scary as that is

        I think you’re probably right.  I have often wondered if it will come, ultimately, to another civil war.  Perhaps another breakup of the union.  It’s too large a large, with too many people, to be ruled by so few.  Much as they talk of democracy and fair elections, we know it’s a crock.  It’s about money and power – it always has been.  It took one civil war to bring slavery to an end, perhaps it will take another to end the power of the oligarchs… not that I am advocating this, only afraid that it might come to be.

        “There is no distinctly native American criminal class save Congress.” - Mark Twain
        • ravensong (1759 posts)
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          20. I don't see a violent civil war as any kind of constructive option.

          Conservatives, even the most downtrodden, indebted, economically disadvantaged conservatives, will fight to the death to maintain the fictional belief systems that have been deliberately instilled into their consciousnesses by malevolent oligarchs and their tools.  For decades, conservatives have been systematically, profoundly brainwashed, by an institutionalized culture of ignorance proliferated and maintained by oligarch controlled hate radio and Fox News, programmed to obey the unspoken commands of the oligarch establishment.  The entire foundation of their belief systems is a type of Stockholm Syndrome related fiction, created for them by the oligarch controllers, who use them as their agents of social, political, and economic control.

          The vast majority of them are beyond hope of breaking through the walls of the matrices which sustain the illusions that form the content and boundaries of their consciousness. Most are programmed to immediately react with shocking aggression when any of the implanted “truths” that form the illusions of their dearly held beliefs are challenged.

          Oh yeah…and they have almost all the guns.

          Seems like a hopeless Catch 22, but I think our only hope is for everyone with a clear mind and a kind heart to unite, and steadfastly engage in peaceful direct actions consisting of multiple forms of non-cooperation that shut down the systems that perpetuate oligarchy.

          Together, together, my friends, we have begun a political revolution to transform America, and that revolution, our revolution, continues. ~ Bernie
      • Enthusiast (10648 posts)
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        16. Fascism, baby! Embrace it. It's a way of life!

        "The NSA’s capability at any time could be turned around on the American people, and no American would have any privacy left, such is the capability to monitor everything. There would be no place to hide."  Frank Church "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men in society, over the course of time they create for themselves a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that glorifies it." - Frederic Bastiat, 1848
      • disillusioned73 (517 posts)
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        18. This thread is depressing me :(

        ” The MSM controls the minds and belief systems of those unfortunates among us who are so lacking in cognitive and perceptual abilities that they can be easily led to act against their own interests (conservatives).  Conservatives are extremely easy for the 1% to control, and they will infinitely repeat the same mistakes while expecting different results.”

        I’m thouroughly convinced that if they can bring the “religious right” into the fold and vote for a Donald Trump… they will vote for ANYONE/ ANYTHING.. “values” are not a factor anymore – if they ever were..

        "Certainly there are some people in the Democratic Party who want to maintain the status quo. They would rather go down with the Titanic so long as they have first-class seats." - Bernie Sanders
        • Eleanors38 (642 posts)
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          28. I call many tRump's supporters "Rippies…"

          You may recall the expression “Yippies,” a late-60s spin-off term from Hippies.  The former were a type of anarchist who may have worn some of the same clothes and hung in the same circles of hippies, but when it came to politics and contemplation of what constitutes the values of a democratic community or state, they were “yeee-HA!” and favored only disruption and disaffection from any set of values and communities based on them.  There’s was attention-grabbing, notorious behavior; a turd on the sidewalk of ANY notion of civility.

          Now, we have the Rippies.  A band of people who went one (or more) better:  Gaining sufficient numbers and clout to win the presidency, but with no real outlook as to why, only to shit on the Kenyan, fuck with liberals, shove it to MSM, and put a turd into every punchbowl seen as PC.  It’s party-time for them, and the party never ends.  It doesn’t matter if tRump grabs ass, gives the finger to minorities, does the stuff a Christian would neve want done to his/her daughter, or lies routinely.  In fact, it is required that he does.  In a very real sense, tRump’s Rippies outgunned the Yippies by a mile.

          And the party continues.

    • pokercat (566 posts)
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      6. It took a tRump to make a Bush look rational. Will we

      ever wake up….maybe, when it’s way too late.

      There isn't a problem that can't be solved by simply lowering your standards. I get more cynical everyday but I just can't keep up.
      • davidthegnome (1198 posts)
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        8. If anyone had told me…

        after the Iraq war, that any future President could make Bush look rational, I would have laughed in their face.  Not so much now.

        “There is no distinctly native American criminal class save Congress.” - Mark Twain
    • Fire with Fire (946 posts)
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      9. Hopelessness

      Is not good for anything.  Even when the situation is hopeless.

       

      Let me share my experience with hope and maybe you will feel a little better.  Or maybe not.

       

      I am a baby boomer, born in 1953.  Joseph McCarthy had spearheaded a red-baiting regime that was in full throttle when I took my first breath of air at my debut at Baylor Hospital in Dallas, Texas, in the “White” wing.  Babies born in the “colored” wing came into this world segregated from white people in just about every way manageable.

      There was an almost invisible civil rights movement, making some progress through the court system.  The idea of using democracy to get people in Dallas or anywhere else to vote an end to segregation was beyond absurd.

      We were still embroiled in the first of our post WWII undeclared wars in Korea in 1953 — and the war was being fought by draftees.  The idea of using democracy to get people to end the tyranny of a military draft was even more of an impossible dream.

      Entertainment was heavily censored and you could be thrown in jail for saying curse words in public.

      Not only was abortion illegal, so was contraception in many states.  Women were paid less than men for the same job on the generally accepted theory that men had families.  My mother told me that at the last job she worked before marrying my father, she was paid exactly one half of what the men around her got — 50 cents an hour versus a dollar for the men.

      It was an openly white supremacist culture and government.  What we call sexism today was called common sense in 1953.  Coming out of World War II, we worshipped our military.  The bogey man was “Communism” which was paradoxically the stupidest possible way to organize industry for productive operations, but also the most formidable military opponent imaginable.  I remember going to bed at night, scared that there might be “communists” in the back yard coming to kill us all.

       

      Anybody who thought that all of the above needed to change was considered a lunatic.  Literally.  You would have to be completely insane not to realize that white people are at the top of the evolutionary table; that women were naturally subordinate to men; that our society needed a draft and a global military presence to keep The Communists from taking us over; that Christianity is our national religion; that sex is for men and women married to each other, and every other way for people to make love is the quintessence of evil.

      All of this grew from the Puritan dominated culture that overran North America, destroying through genocide the cultures of the people who got here before us.  Once established, our predecessors brought slaves here to grow the agricultural products that our early mercantilists traded to Europe, enabling us to build up our own industrial base.  We told ourselves disgusting lies to keep from facing the truth that our wealth came as a direct result of genocide and slavery.

       

      Yet there were hundreds of thousands of activists who resisted.  They rarely won much of anything, but they kept trying.  Martin Luther King appeared on the national scene, reviving the political strategies conceived by Thoreau and Gandhi.

      ============

       

      OK — I hope you get the drift.  I saw legal segregation end; I saw the draft end; I saw the idea of white supremacy lose its legitimacy and be banished from polite society; I saw women escape from subservience to husbands; I saw gay, lesbian, bi-sexual and transgendered people come out of their respective closets and on and on it goes.

      Things change.  If you are looking to end racism — it still is not gone.  But it is not the same as it was in 1953 as millions of people got in the street and took other actions of protest to force the culture to change.  If you are looking to end war — it is still not gone, even though the draft is gone, thanks to millions of people uniting in opposition.

       

      I see public opinion is an ever evolving mishmash of contradictions.  If you want for people to “wake up” and agree with your personal assessment of who is in charge and why they do what they do, my life experience clearly shows that you will be disappointed.  People don’t wake up, but they do get mad.  I have seen it before, and what we are seeing now is just like the early stages of the Sixties, when Martin Luther King acquainted American with the tactics advocated by Henry David Thoreau and Mohandas Gandhi.

      We won on a long list of issues.  It seems to me that our biggest weakness is that only old fucks like me remember what it was like to win.  That makes people despair when despair is the only thing that can beat us.  As Bernie says and as I saw in the late 60s, when people come together, we win.

       

      There will never be a Golden Age when we banish all evil and all is harmony.  New problems, new prejudices and new schemes of profit will keep coming up so long as our species survives.

      But the one thing I can guarantee you is that nothing stays the same for very long.

       

      • Fire with Fire (946 posts)
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        10. Biggest laugh I ever heard in a movie theater

        By 1970, the American cultural revolution was in full swing.  The Vietnam War showed no signs of ending, and the antiwar movement was turning out hundreds of thousands of people in demonstrations against it.  Still living in Dallas, I was a junior in high school when Robert Altman’s M*A*S*H was released.  Now considered one of the all time great movies, I saw it in a packed theater.

        When this exchange occurred, the audience erupted into the loudest sustained laugh I have ever heard before or since.  Had this joke been in a movie about the Korean War at the time when I was born the reaction would not he been to laugh — and in a place like Dallas, the crowd might well have booed.

        I hope you can appreciate why it was so funny at that particular point in history:

         

         

      • Coldmountaintrail (3690 posts)
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        14. I agree with the sentiment, but want to not that the civil rights movement

        would quickly become ‘visible’:

        In 1954 came Brown v. Board of Ed and the formal end of segregation in the US military

        In 1955 the Montgomery Bus Boycott began and Eisenhower’s non-discrimination policy in the federal government.

        1956: The SC ruled against segregation on buses nationally.

        By that time many schools, higher and lower, had integrated (though met with resistance).

        To me it looks like the feds led, the movement followed.  Or it was pretty simultaneous.

        • Fire with Fire (946 posts)
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          19. ooops

          (I stupidly mistook this post as coming from the OP — this is a corrected version of what I think about this post.)

           

          How do you think Brown v. Board of Education got to the Supreme Court in the first place?  Are you familiar with the life story of Thurgood Marshall?  Although it was me who used the expression, “almost invisible” to describe the civil rights movement, I did not mean to imply that it did not exist or that it did nothing.  On the contrary, I used that expression to compare civil rights activists from the Abolition movement through to the 1950s to those of us today fighting against the corporate owned fake democracy that is right now acting exactly as described in the OP.

          Brown v. Board of Education was NOT “the Feds” — and it accomplished virtually nothing in practical terms by itself.  I started public school in 1959 when both Brown and I were six years old.  In spite of that mandate from “the Feds,” my schools in Dallas were lily-white, and segregation continued without a hiccup.  This was the case all over the country as local school boards and local politicians defied “the Feds” with impunity.

          George Wallace stood in the admissions office doorway blocking the admittance of a black student who had successfully persuaded a Federal Judge to order his acceptance into the University of Alabama.  In Georgia, Governor Lester Maddox won his position by calling himself “Ax Handle” — to celebrate his response to the “Feds” passing the civil rights act by threatening African Americans who attempted to enter his fried chicken restaurant by brandishing an ax-handle as a club.

          In Dallas, the litigation from those civil rights activists who were supposedly just the lucky beneficiaries of “the Feds” actions on their behalf, finally forced the integration of Dallas schools when I got to junior high school in 1967.  The first step was for the first time to allow sports competition between the white and black schools — still segregated 14 years after “the Feds” ended school segregation.  And the icing on this institutional racism cake was that all the interracial football games were played in the daytime on a Saturday, while all other games continued to be played at night.

           

          I recite all this to underline my point that there has been struggle between justice and money forever.  Now is just like every other point in history.  Your response — unintentionally, I believe — was an insult to the thousands of brave activists who stood up for their human rights for decades.  It was their courageous effort that built and sustained the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People in the face of violent repression both from private criminals such as Klansmen and state actors like Sheriffs.  Without their bravery and determination to stand up for what is right against opposition that was much more violent, ruthless and relentless than anything you and I are looking at today, nothing would have ever changed.

          It took sustained effort by activists to get cases to the Supreme Court.  It took far more effort from activists to get it enforced over the next few decades.  Had the people who bravely kept their movement alive asked the question, “When will we wake up?” they would have quit.  Even as legal segregation is in our past, racism still exists.  If they had waited for people to wake up before taking action, my old school in Dallas would still be for whites only.

           

           

           

           

          • Coldmountaintrail (3690 posts)
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            22. If a case is filed with the SC, it's a federal filing, and if the SC takes

            the case, the decision isn’t random.  It’s the result of political and economic considerations.

            Just like the decision to hear Citizens’ United wasn’t random.

            Why was the court — and the federal government — so open to integration at this particular point in US history?

            You can say it’s because of a long history of activism.  You could say the same thing about the labor movement.

            Yet here we are, integrated into  a burning building (if you know the quote).

             

             

    • Deadpool (11537 posts)
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      11. On the Daily Radical!

    • ctsnowman (599 posts)
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      15. I agree with everything except

      that Trump is worse than Bush. I have yet to see anything remotely as bad as the war on Iraq. We are still paying for that mess as is the rest of the middle east. Trump could end up committing far worse but I have not seen it yet.

      Army and Navy veteran and a proud liberal.
    • disillusioned73 (517 posts)
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      17. I completely agree..

      the majority of the populace has been dumbed down to the point where thay wait for their orders from their respective PTB.. be it team red or be it team blue.. all with corporate consequences so I won’t dare call it left & right anymore.. that shit has sailed, this right/right dichotomy is the begining of the end and it is thouroughly entrenched..

      I know it’s been said a million times, but people seriosly need to wake up.. but the distractions are way to enticing & the media loves to feed them their chum.. with vigor.

      "Certainly there are some people in the Democratic Party who want to maintain the status quo. They would rather go down with the Titanic so long as they have first-class seats." - Bernie Sanders
    • dlegendary1 (1052 posts)
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      27. As long as the corporate media remains the king of news

      I sincerely doubt it. People are still upset over confederate statues instead of the gutting of our education system. Kneeling during the anthem has replaced police brutality and sexual assaults by Hollywood executives make more headlines than sexual assaults by corporate executives (even small time execs). They control the dialogue and most of us fall for it. Until this changes all of our opinions will be made before any of us have time to think about it. Television is still a powerful medium.

      These mofos at the DNC can lick mah balls! I'm not voting or supporting their 3rd way goons.
    • Koko (4320 posts)
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      30. It may be that it gets so Horrific that "Blow Back"

      will finally be a possibility.  But, we aren’t there yet.  Sady….Very Sadly… but it will come.

      People aren’t awake yet.  Hopefully they will look back and find some the Historical Research that we all did for years (decades) and become engaged once they understand what our MSM (of today) has failed to report.

      What you say at the end:

      Are our memories truly so short? Is there really not a damn thing that can be done to stop this moronic chain of events? We may have stopped (temporarily) the repeal of the ACA and the disastrous healthcare bill brought forth by idiots, but there will be more to come. Eventually, what seems most likely is that the democrats will give the conservatives half of what they want and call it a compromise – when what is actually necessary is the exact opposite of what is happening.

      Will we ever wake up?

    • hopemountain (2336 posts)
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      31. so many great posts expressed here –

      thanks, david. bookmarked.

      "economic and environmental justice is spiritual work." ~ tom b. k. goldtooth .... "question everything – including, organizations touting labels proclaiming stewardship of living things and high ideals when in truth, they fanatically practice the stewardship of exploitation, greed, and destruction."