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  • Scott Crowder (612 posts)
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    Transcripts released on DNC lawsuit

    http://jampac.us/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/042517cw2.pdf

    I read through it all and thought I’d post some of the more interesting parts.

    The DNC lawyers (hereafter referred to simply as The DNC.) try to argue that the court has no right to judge how they enforce internal rules.

    THE COURT:
    You’re talking about the DNC’s charter
    now.
    MR. SPIVA:
    Yes, their bylaws, which is where this
    purported obligation arises to remain neutral as between the
    candidates.
    THE COURT:
    Article V, Section 4.

    The DNC says their duty to conduct a free and fair election is a “purported obligation”.

    The plaintiffs lawyers (hereafter referred to as The American People) shoot that argument down completely:

    in Madigan vs. Illinois, a 2006
    opinion from the Supreme Court, the Court held:
    “Consistent with our precedent and the First
    Amendment, states may maintain fraud actions when
    fundraisers make false or misleading representations
    designed to deceive donors about how their donations
    are used.”

    Furthermore:

    This is not a case about enforcing political promises.
    They want you to think that, I believe, because they want to
    paint this case in a line of cases that have been filed
    throughout the years where candidates may make political
    promises, and then disappointed voters bring lawsuits to
    enforce those promises or seek damages in one form or another.
    But that’s not what this case is about. We’re not talking
    about campaign rhetoric. We’re not talking about a campaign
    platform of any kind.
    What we’re talking about here is the very core of what
    our democracy runs on, the very basis for our democracy, which
    is the conduct of free and fair elections. That’s the basis,
    that’s the bedrock on which the claims of this case take off,
    because the election — the elections — as American history
    has developed, the conduct of those elections, for better or
    worse, has come under the domain of the two major political
    parties in this country.

    And then The American People address the real reason the Democrats want you to get all riled up about Russian intervention and take your eyes off of the Real Ball:

    I just think the context of when this complaint was
    drafted is important. We drafted this complaint and filed it
    in June of 2016, which was before the DNC primary — or the DNC
    convention occurred in July. And, at the time, the evidence
    that we had access to consisted of this set of documents that

    your Honor referenced in your prefatory remarks that were
    released by a figure named Guccifer 2.0.
    And the core document that was released by that
    individual on that website purports to be an internal DNC
    memorandum, which outlines a strategy for advancing Hillary
    Clinton to the nomination of the Democratic Party before the
    primaries had even really gotten off the ground. And this was
    at a time — you know, Bernie Sanders I believe had announced
    for about a month before this particular memo came out. But we
    think that’s clear evidence of what the DNC’s intent was
    throughout the primary process. It was to leverage their
    connections with the media in order to advance Hillary
    Clinton’s candidacy at the expense of everybody else.

    These additional leaks have shown that DNC officials
    participated in creating and disseminating media narratives to
    undermine Bernie Sanders and advance Hillary Clinton.
    It shows former DNC Chair Donna Brazile giving debate

    questions in advance to Hillary Clinton during the primaries.
    It shows the DNC at one point changing its donor
    policies specifically to favor Hillary Clinton.
    It shows the scheduling of debates to favor Hillary
    Clinton over Bernie Sanders.
    It shows, in general, the DNC pouring its considerable
    resources and relationships into propelling Hillary Clinton to
    the nomination.

    And then the judge makes The DNC  look like unprepared idiots:

    THE COURT:
    Does the DNC help to fund the state
    primaries?
    MR. SPIVA:
    Uhm, you mean literally, the mechanics of
    the primaries, your Honor, the actual holding of the election,
    the primary election?
    THE COURT:
    Does the DNC, with the money that it
    raises, use some of that money to help fund the states put on
    their individual state primaries?
    MR. SPIVA:
    I don’t believe so, your Honor. No.
    THE COURT:
    But you don’t know.

    And then The DNC alleges it has the inherent right to fix elections:

    The party could have favored a candidate.  Even if it were true, that’s the business
    of the party, and it’s not justiciable.
    THE COURT:
    All right. Thank you, Counsel.
    MR. SPIVA:
    Thank you. And I’m happy to answer —
    THE COURT:
    Oh, no, I’ve got more questions.

    And then the judge hands it over to The American People to slam dunk The DNC:

    THE COURT:
    What does the plaintiff say on the
    operational aspect of the DNC?
    MR. BECK:
    Well, your Honor, I’m shocked to hear that
    we can’t define what it means to be evenhanded and impartial.
    If that were the case, we couldn’t have courts. I mean, that’s
    what courts do every day, is decide disputes in an evenhanded
    and impartial manner.

    I think that’s why the Democratic National Committee has it in
    its charter, because if you don’t have the organization that is
    responsible for organizing in this very large sense the
    nominating process for president, which entails multiple
    elections in every state of the union, if you’re not evenhanded
    and impartial, then you don’t have a democratic process. I
    think it’s that simple.

    And then we get into the whole gist of what is a democracy and what constitutes fraud.

    THE COURT:
    Let me ask counsel. If a person is fraudulently
    induced to donate to a charitable organization, does he have
    standing to sue the person who induced the donation?

    The DNC tries to weasel out of giving a direct answer to the question and instead addresses other hypothetical situations other than what the judge asked.  The judge then allows The American People their reaction to The DNC’s response and this is what they had to say:

    THE COURT:
    First, your response to their answers.
    MR. BECK:
    Yes. And I’ll take the last part first,
    which was the question your Honor had posed, is there — and
    I’m paraphrasing it, but is there a material difference between
    a campaign promise, such as “read my lips, no new taxes,” and
    representations that are made in the DNC’s own charter?
    And, quite frankly, if what defendant — or what the
    DNC has just said is true — and I really hope it’s not true,
    but if what he said is true, then I think it’s a really sad day
    for democracy in this country. Because what essentially the
    DNC has now stated in a court of law is that it believes that
    there is no enforceable obligation to run the primary elections
    of this country’s democracy in a fair and impartial manner.
    And if that’s the case — and I think counsel just said it himself — then really, you know, the sky’s the limit
    in terms of what the DNC and any party, for that matter, can
    do.

    After a few hours of wrangling over jurisdictional issues and so on, I found this to be quite interesting:

    (The American People)

    it just doesn’t make sense to me why
    somebody would participate in a political process by paying
    money into the process, when they knew that that process was
    rigged from the start, which is what we’re alleging.

    To which The DNC replies:

    I think actually the opposite conclusion is more
    logical and certainly apparent, that you would to try to beat
    the system, if you viewed it as rigged.

    The DNC tried to say that there can’t be a class action because:

    we would still have the right, your Honor, to challenge each
    class member’s standing. Did they rely on statements of the
    DNC? Did they even know about them? Would they have not given
    if they had known? Same with the Sanders subclass. Same with
    the third subclass.

    To which The American People replied:

    MR. BECK:
    Again, I think that — I think,
    fundamentally, people give money to candidates and can — and
    political parties, because they believe that we have a fair
    democratic process. And I think that that’s a baseline
    assumption whenever a donation is made.

    I think that there’s a fundamental understanding in
    this country that’s taught from a very early age, certainly I
    remember it, that we live in a democracy. And I think a
    fundamental part of what a democracy means is that elections
    are not conducted in this biased and predetermined way. And I
    think that everybody who seeks to participate in the political
    process, especially when they’re going to the trouble of
    cutting a check to a candidate that they support or a party
    that they support, they believe that those candidates and
    entities are taking place in a process that is fair and impartial,

    because they believe in a process that’s democratic.
    So, I don’t think someone necessarily needs to read
    the articles we’ve cited or the charter to be in the class of
    people that have been defrauded or deceived or unjustly treated
    in terms of the unjust enrichment claim by the DNC’s conduct.

    And in their closing statements, The American People stated:

    If it’s the case that an entity, the DNC, its
    chairperson can rig an election, and there’s no remedy at law
    for people who’ve made financial contributions on the basis of
    what they’ve omitted to tell the public, well, I submit that
    that’s a really dire road for this country to be on.

    Then the judge closed the proceedings with this statement:

    This is a
    very interesting case, to say the least. And counsel for the
    plaintiffs spoke about whether or not our society — these are
    the Court’s words, not his words, he did not use the word
    “society” — but whether society is in a dire situation. And
    so I leave the lawyers with this. Democracy demands the truth
    so people can make intelligent decisions.

     

    twenty, Blackspade, hopemountain and 59 othersIwillnevergiveup, ElfinWilde, As Seen on the Internet, Marym625, Shlabotnik, Pacco Fransisco, Baba OhReally, MistaP, tk2kewl, libodem, PDiddie, BillZBubb, spud demon, disillusioned73, Marooned, Rocker, iggy, WillyT, Bernblu, , nevereVereven, Two way street, mak3cats, Enthusiast, Billsmile, Average Gazoo, xynthee, Grateful Curd, djean111, jdpriestly, bbgrunt, Flying Squirrel, cui bono, graycat, Odd John, resist99, roguevalley, mindwalker, Rozinante, 99thMonkey, Silver Witch, Hari, Peace Patriot, RadicleFantast, ChefEric, MrMickeysMom, Doremus Jessup, virgdem, LaaDeeDaaVA, wilsonbooks, Ferd Berfel, arendt, Pangolino, Bernice Ta, ZimInSeattle, Babel 17, mmonk, RufusTFirefly, ThouArtThat like this
    Think of all the “moderates” who, throughout history, have failed to oppose state-sanctioned aggression, oppression, and abuse, from slavery to child labor, while maligning those who call for change as dangerous and misguided, violent radicals. And yet, in retrospect, when a renewed social contract is established as the new normal, the unlawful actions that brought about these societal shifts are turned into mythical tales of nationalistic heroism and dates for kids to memorize at school.
    https://limitedhangoutblog.com/2017/02/08/lets-talk-about-violence/

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24 replies
  • ThouArtThat (5401 posts)
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    1. Thank You For Sharing

    eom

    "In America Today, Power Corrupts and Money Corrupts Absolutely" - Anonymous  
  • ZimInSeattle (1467 posts)
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    2. Outstanding! Thank you.

    Proudly #DemExited & #LeftOut  | "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable" - JFK | Bernie would have WON!  |“Fascism is a result of the failure of the left to provide an alternative” - Leon Trotsky | Sanders/Gabbard 2020 (PPP
  • Ferd Berfel (5232 posts)
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    3. yes thanks for posting this

    The DNC is obviously a criminal enterprise and needs to be crushed

    …and you think you’re going to stop this simply by ‘pulling a lever’, in a booth, behind a curtain, every 2 years? - Know yourself. And if you need help with that, call the FBI. -  There is only ONE solution to this mess:  New Party !  
  • Enlightenment (887 posts)
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    4. I read through this the other day

    in preparation for a debate with a Hillbot (who is also the president of the local League of Women Voters and thinks she knows everything there is to know – ever – about politics).  Turns out that she chose to deflect and practice her goal-post shifting, so no debate ensued – as I ascribe to the theory that it is impossible to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.

    It is stunning and I hope the judge recognizes just how egregiously weak the DNCs arguments are.

    The part where the judge questions Spiva about whether or not the DNC funds state parties made me chuckle, since that treads perilously close to the whole “Victory Fund” thing that allowed Clinton to rake in far more money than she was legally entitled to, and shorted the state parties as a result.

    Every single one of them should be breaking rocks in a prison yard.

    All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies. - John Arbuthnot, 1637-1735
  • Doremus Jessup (2975 posts)
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    5. JPR rec!

    Fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity. End ALL occupations and bring the troops home.
  • MrMickeysMom (1743 posts)
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    6. Scott, thanks for precisely putting it together like this…

    And now, I say… Let the subpoenas begin.

    Hell no...I'm not giving up...     cat-gif-238.gif giphy.gif
    • Hari (1111 posts)
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      7. subpoenas?

      The sooner the better for us all.

  • Silver Witch (5426 posts)
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    8. Excellent summation of the proceedings.

    Thank you for so carefully putting forth the absurdity of the DNC and the non-existence of Fair and Just in the DNC’s opinion.

    #Let'sTalkRevolution
  • 99thMonkey (3766 posts)
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    9. "Democracy demands the truth so people can make intelligent decisions" No shit!

    Great summary sentence. Cuts to the core of the whole story .. Most excellent post.  Herby nominated for the Daily Radical.  Mary, where are you?

    1000 recs. Thank you!!

    • jdpriestly (5879 posts)
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      13. i agree with your post. Thanks.

      No Truth!  No Trust!  Bernie or Bust!
  • Rozinante (3694 posts)
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    10. Sounds like the lawyer for plaintiffs nailed it.

    DNC is putting up a rather bizarre and feeble defense. Hope they go down in flames.

    http://deadstate.org/conspiracy-theories-make-people-feel-like-theyre-special/
  • cui bono (1630 posts)
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    11. Thanks for posting.

    Bookmarking to read tomorrow… right now I have to continue watching Twin Peaks then go to bed. 

    The DNC can try to squash us but we'll just come back stronger.   
  • jdpriestly (5879 posts)
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    12. Great update. Thanks.

    No Truth!  No Trust!  Bernie or Bust!
  • Average Gazoo (1473 posts)
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    14. Rec and thanks for some sanity

  • Enthusiast (10167 posts)
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    15. Recommended to max!

    "The NSA’s capability at any time could be turned around on the American people, and no American would have any privacy left, such is the capability to monitor everything. There would be no place to hide."  Frank Church "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men in society, over the course of time they create for themselves a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that glorifies it." - Frederic Bastiat, 1848
  • mak3cats (416 posts)
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    16. Thank you so much for this…

    My SO and I signed on to this class action way back, and I haven’t been able to keep up.

    Go placidly amid the noise and haste and remember what peace there may be in silence.
    • iggy (1679 posts)
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      18. I signed on too

      I live on minimal Social Security, yet I donated a considerable sum to what I thought was the Bernie Sanders Campaign. When I read about the DNC shenanigans, I was really furious. I had been defrauded. You bet I signed up. I hope they win triple damages and buy the Democratic Party name. Kick these Third Way motherfuckers to the curb and start fresh.

      Truth has no Expiration Date. Life without Dignity is Slavery.
  • WillyT (10129 posts)
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    17. Thank You For This !!!

    :fistbump:

     

  • BillZBubb (2805 posts)
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    19. Big rec on this one!

    The judge’s last sentence is ominous for the DNC douchebags.

     

    DemExit! Don't give the Democrats a dime. Don't identify as a Democrat. Drop Democratic identification below 20%. Only then will they support true progressive policy. Until then, corporate money rules.
  • libodem (1034 posts)
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    20. We weren't wrong

    In sensing this was destined to be a Coronation.

    Why even bother with the pretense of a primary if you have your preordained princess picked prior?

    Do you suppose because we put up with Super delegates that DNC figures we know outcomes are manipulated?

    Sick of the effing lying, cheating, stealing, bastids. Eff them.

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  • Marym625 (26294 posts)
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    22. This, I believe, bodes well

    "Once the decision was made to go into Iraq as an invader and occupier,  it’s like our nation lost its conscience. And it has not yet gotten that conscience back." Madfloridian  
  • Iwillnevergiveup (688 posts)
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    23. Scott Crowder

    You put some time and effort into this for which I am deeply appreciative.  Thank you.

    We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.     Native American Proverb
    • Scott Crowder (612 posts)
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      24. Thank you

      Actually, I’d finished the article and hit the wrong button and the whole thing up and disappeared and I almost didn’t go back and rewrite it.

      Think of all the “moderates” who, throughout history, have failed to oppose state-sanctioned aggression, oppression, and abuse, from slavery to child labor, while maligning those who call for change as dangerous and misguided, violent radicals. And yet, in retrospect, when a renewed social contract is established as the new normal, the unlawful actions that brought about these societal shifts are turned into mythical tales of nationalistic heroism and dates for kids to memorize at school.
      https://limitedhangoutblog.com/2017/02/08/lets-talk-about-violence/