Home Topics in Depth Progressive Parties We do not support the current recount being undertaken by Jill Stein

  • coolepairc (190 posts)
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    We do not support the current recount being undertaken by Jill Stein

    Greens Speak Out on Recount and Our Commitment to an Independent Party Posted by Margaret Flowers

    We write to reaffirm our commitment to building a Green Party that has a radical analysis of the society in which we live, and promotes bold solutions to transform our society and address the root causes of those crises; a Green Party that is independent of the two money-dominated parties.

    There is a deep social crisis in the US. This crisis manifests in countless ways. One of its central manifestations is through the political system. People have legitimate concerns about the electoral system, which is manipulated through wholesale voter disenfranchisement, massive voter suppression and the racist and undemocratic historical logic of the Electoral College. In all fifty states, voters from poor and marginalized communities, especially Black people and other communities of color, have their votes suppressed and are excluded from participation through various practices.

    The Green Party cannot build the political power necessary for the transformative changes we need by allying with two capitalist parties that serve the interests of the wealthy. That is why it is imperative that the Green Party is independent of those parties. We stay independent to give people an alternative to the corruption of two money-based parties. Greens reject donations from corporations and their political action committees to ensure we are accountable to the people and so that the people’s agenda is not superseded by the corporate agenda.

    There are significant electoral reforms needed to make elections more democratic and more representative of the people. While we support electoral reforms, including how the vote is counted, we do not support the current recount being undertaken by Jill Stein.

    ~Snip~

    As a candidate, Dr. Stein has the right to call for a recount. However, we urge the GPUS to distance itself from any appearance of support for either Democrats or Republicans. We are well aware of the undemocratic actions taken during the primaries by the DNC and the Clinton campaign. Greens cannot be perceived to be allied with such a party.

    ~Snip~

    More at: Greens Speak Out on Recount and Our Commitment to an Independent Party

    LWolf, Pam, Scrubpine and 9 othersleveymg, Babel 17, Silver Witch, Arctic Dave, Spanishprof27, davidgmills, Mom Cat, ThouArtThat, djean111 like this

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17 replies
  • Mom Cat (6600 posts)
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    1. I respect Margaret Flowers and all that she has done.

    I for one agree with her.

         NEVER FORGET      BERNIE WON!          
  • Billy (1979 posts)
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    That’s good. What she’s doing is not helping the greens chances.

  • davidgmills (4051 posts)
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    3. By picking the states Stein did, the perception is clearly that Stein is helping

    The Democrats and not being neutral.

    French Revolution; not secession.
  • coolepairc (190 posts)
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    4. The division in the party gets worse still

    From Jill Stein’s running mate: ‘I’m not in favor of the recount’

    ~Snip~

    The Green Party’s Jill Stein has received a bounty of attention and money since she announced her intent to request election recounts in several states, but prominent voices within her party are rebuking the effort.

    Among them: her own running mate, Ajamu Baraka, who told CNN on Tuesday: “I’m not in favor of the recount.”

  • Autumn (564 posts)
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    5. So just like the dem party, fuck the right of the people to

    know if their votes are counted.

    • coolepairc (190 posts)
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      6. The devil may be in the details

      I can’t speak for Margaret Flowers, Ajamu Baraka or any of the other Greens that have spoken publicly to the issue, but it may be they don’t support this particular recount, the decision-making process that led to it, and the manner in which it is being carried out.

      • Autumn (564 posts)
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        7. We all know that no recount is going to change this election. 

        I think election integrity is an important issue,  I’m glad Jill thinks so too.

    • Silver Witch (4129 posts)
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      9. No you have the right to know.

      This recount by Stein and Clinton has nothing to do with securing crap. The anomaly was more down ticket Dem votes then Clinton got. That anomaly was us Dems who didn’t vote for Clinton but voted down ticket dem. Pure and simple.

      If there is to be a recount then recount ALL votes not just where Clinton lost.  This move is clearly trickery and malicious.

      #Let'sTalkRevolution
  • Silver Witch (4129 posts)
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    8. Ha I knew it. This has Clinton STINK all over it.

    Not Green Party but rather Stein on her own with the backing of someone who PROMISED her something.

    I can go back to believing in the Green Party again. Stein on the other hand joins infamy.

    #Let'sTalkRevolution
    • FanBoy (7016 posts)
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      13. but she has *integrity*. integrity, that's all you need to know.

    • Babel 17 (2227 posts)
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      17. Retrospect might show Clinton to have been in a lose-lose situation

      Sitting idly by, while her most devoted supporters fume and want action, and as Stein constructs from scratch a grass roots movement to answer their questions, has incredibly bad optics for Clinton. It was the grass roots efforts of Sanders that nearly caused the upset of the century; to look disconnected from events while another grass movements took place right under her nose, and ostensibly for her and her supporters benefit, just isn’t sustainable.

      This lose-lose scenario was enabled by people, who advocated for Clinton during her campaign, grumbling about the results. That provided the fertile ground for Jill Stein to look credible in asking for recounts. The Clinton supporters now couldn’t have it both ways. If they wanted to grumble and make Trump look less legitimate, they then had to accept Stein’s efforts as laudable.

      The real kicker is that if the recounts turn up nada, zilch, zero, nothing, that improves Clinton’s numbers, then the Clinton team loses their grumbling point, looks like sore losers, and looks somewhat hypocritical for doing what they ridiculed Trump for promising to do.

      The odds makers might be saying that there’s a decent chance that Team Clinton is going to be suffering a fair degree of suffering from these results, and only a very small chance of getting just a bit of vindication. The odds of making the election results look substantially in doubt remain astronomical.

      So, by starting this recount movement, one can argue Stein put the Clinton camp in a lose-lose situation. Or even a lose-lose-lose one.

      They could have ridiculed the effort, and thus enraged their supporters, and undermined their talking point about the results looking iffy. They could have done and said nothing, and thus looked useless and out of touch. Or they could become engaged in it, and thus take on what  I consider a bad bet.

      Stein forced their hand, while making herself much more prominent. I think Stein could be playing her hand better, but she’s gained a real great talking point for 2020 should she run, and she might be gaining some defectors should the Democrats run yet another establishment candidate.

      She might end up a net loser here, politically, but for her this was a smart gamble. I wish she was now going for more states, but I recognize it would have been harder to get this started if she hadn’t focused on those states Trump won. I’m cynical enough to think Stein knows she might end up getting back in a lot of people’s good graces if whatever lapses in the election process end up getting exposed do nothing to help Clinton.

      The big win for Stein would be if she picks up a notable number of net votes, and nobody else does.

  • zoolook67 (547 posts)
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    10. I didn't vote for Jill, but I respect her and

    I think she deserves a lot of credit for doing this. It shows me a sense of public

    duty. Flowers’s letter doesn’t have a reason not to do the recount. It seems to say, “We are the Greens. We don’t get into the dirt with those lesser parties. We want to remain pure.” I’m sorry if this offends anyone. I’ve been a Green. I’ve contributed and stuffed envelopes etc.etc. But the greens, imho and I think this election shows it, that the Greens are pure, alright, but absolutely too pure to play real, hardball, PRAGMATIC  politics. They’ve been around for many years and have never yet become more than a glorified club, politically.  I am glad that Bernie didn’t take up Jill’s offer. That really would have been a terrible fit and bad for Bernie, and Bernie knew it. I think Jill would be great for any other progressive party, real, imagined, or hypothetical, that has, not only the passion for change, but also the willingness to do the dirty work, the unpleasant compromises, the less than noble acceptances. She is a fighter. I admire her. I hope she finds a more deserving political home.

    Living well is the best revenge.
  • Babel 17 (2227 posts)
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    11. Stein can help this by using leftover cash to check states Clinton won narrowly

    Yeah, it will be too late for a recount, but the data can be analyzed. The purpose mainly being to say that Stein isn’t pointing fingers, she’s just saying with elections this close there’s not much margin for error.

  • leveymg (2027 posts)
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    12. Life is but a play, and we are all but the players.

    There are no legitimate choices left in American presidential politics.  None.

  • Skink (452 posts)
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    14. here