Why all progressives should support Cenk Uygur for Congress

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    • #239798
      Ohio Barbarian
      Moderator
      • Total Posts: 14,561

      Before I get to my reasons for the title, I’d like to address two things concerning Cenk Uygur. First, I know a lot of people are upset with him for how he jumped on and sermonized from the Vote Blue No Matter Who bandwagon in 2016 after Hillary secured the nomination. I wasn’t watching TYT then, but if I had been, I would have been royally pissed at him, too.

      There’s no way I could ever vote for Hillary Clinton, period. I voted for Jill Stein. It was not a vote for Trump. It was not a vote for Hillary. It was a vote for the principles espoused by the Green Party at the time. Cenk called people like me stupid. It’s no surprise I vehemently disagree with that assertion, and I think Cenk was wrong by making it. I also know Cenk would join the VBNMW crowd again if someone like Joe Biden won the nomination. So what? It would have no more effect on me next year than it did in 2016. Sometimes, it really is best to look at current circumstances and let bygones be bygones. Besides, holding grudges is bad for my hypertension.

      Second, I want to lay this whole Bernie unendorsement of Cenk thing to bed. To put it in the closet, in the attic, in the basement, in the garbage. Bernie is one of those rare politicians with a consistent record. Cenk is not. According to Cenk himself, he didn’t want to risk hurting the Sanders campaign because he said some stupid shit 5 or 10 or 20 years ago. Because, like Elizabeth Warren or Motherfucker Mike, he was a Republican once upon a time. Because he’d tried to emulate Howard Stern years ago and made some raunchy jokes. Because he’s an ethnic Turk and was raised not to believe in the Armenian genocide.

      Cenk’s clearly not a Republican or a conservative now, and that’s to his credit. It just shows he thinks, and is a big enough human being to admit it when he realizes he is wrong. Cenk Uygur said on Jimmy Dore and other places that it was his decision to reject all endorsements and use the vicious Vichy attacks to raise more campaign cash, and that he didn’t want Bernie spending time defending him. I’ll take Cenk at his word. He founded TYT and Wolf-Pac and co-founded Justice Democrats and therefore helped give us AOC and Omar and Tlaib. His number one issue is getting legalized bribery out of politics. He’s earned some trust, at least with me.

      Now let’s look at what Cenk would actually do if he is elected to Congress. He’s said, and I believe him, that he will call out all the Republicans and Democrats who take legalized bribes and do the bidding of their donors on the floor of the House of Representatives. He’ll get right in their faces. He’ll get the issue in the news more than it is now. Does anyone really think that he won’t do that? Come on, you know he will. He’s big and he’s brash and he doesn’t give a shit about Congressional etiquette. He’s a fucking pit bull. Progressives need someone like that in Congress, and here he is.

      Cenk would loudly support President Sanders in Congress. He’s for Medicare-for-All, free public college, eliminating student debt, the Green New Deal, a humane immigration policy, ending regime change wars, a wealth tax, reversing Citizens United, and actually doing something to reverse the inequality of wealth that has been growing since 1981. I don’t agree with Cenk on everything, and I know you don’t, either, but I do agree with him on many critical issues and I know he’ll storm the gates of the corrupt Washington establishment like his ancestors once stormed Constantinople.

      Finally, I know Cenk can be an arrogant SOB. Well, they say it takes one to know one, and I know I can be one as well. So, for what it’s worth, Cenk, from one arrogant leftist  SOB to another, you go. Go get ’em! Give ’em hell! Just win, baby. Everyone else, please consider supporting him. Send him a little money if you can. Punch the Vichy Dems right in the gut.

      That’s all. Thanks for reading. Good day, and good luck.

      It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

      Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

    • #239813
      salemcourt
      Participant
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    • #239814
      ThouArtThat
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 3,252

      @ohiobarbarian

      Hi ob,

      All good points.  I would only add that democracy in America is way past need for reform.  And achieving that reform is way past prior standards of decorum relying on outdated definitions of gentility or civility.  Cenk will be a muckraker extraordinaire.  A destabilizing force of nature to shake up aging and decrepit institutions long past their sell by dates.  This citizen welcomes a new thunder in The People’s House.

      TAT

      Sooner or later we all sit down to a banquet of consequences.

      - Robert Louis Stevenson

      Politics is the entertainment division of the Military Industrial Complex.

      - Frank Zappa

    • #239815
      David the Gnome
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,604

      I’m not sure, OB.  I support most of what he says – but I do wonder about 2016, the blue no matter who business.  Could be he would be an important voice for change… or could be he’d ultimately become just another Vichy dem.  I suppose, without some kind of crystal ball, at present, I would support him over most.

      • #239858
        Ohio Barbarian
        Moderator
        • Total Posts: 14,561

        @davidthegnome I gave my take on the vote blue no matter who business. I disagree with Cenk over that. He goes for the lesser of two evils thing and we don’t. I just think it’s irrelevant as far as the congressional election goes, and  Cenk is clearly the best candidate in his district as far as progressives are concerned.

        Besides, the fact that Nancy Pelosi and Diane Feinstein endorsed his Democratic opponent is reason enough for me to pull for Cenk all by itself. That SV positively hates the man is another.

        It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

        Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

    • #239830
      closeupready
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,335

      I respect your passion for his run, and he has a lot going for him, but I’m not sold on him.

      He talks a good talk, but what about Jordan Chariton?  Or Jeffrey Katzenberg?

      You are correct that he is a thinker, and someone who calls himself a reformer, but if both things are true, then I can’t figure out what he was thinking in either of these two questionable courses of action.  So I’m on the sidelines.

      The opinions and personal views expressed herein are solely those of the author, and should never be taken seriously.

      • #239842
        ThouArtThat
        Participant
        • Total Posts: 3,252

        @closeupready

        Hi closeupready,

        I can’t speak to Katzenberg.  However, in the case of Chariton I can say that TYT’s response was totally consistent with current corporate policies.  As a former senior manager, corporate America has a zero tolerance policy with even the hint of sexual misconduct, deserved or not, by staff.  I well remember two employees fired from Ericsson’s American subsidiary for merely being suspected of sexual misconduct when all that existed was allegation.  And this was long before the me-too movement.  Basically, corporate America has adopted this standard because sexual misconduct cases are almost always a loser and the threat of a lawsuit is to be avoided at all costs.  As soon as sexual allegations were raised, right or wrong, Chariton was toast.

        TAT

        Sooner or later we all sit down to a banquet of consequences.

        - Robert Louis Stevenson

        Politics is the entertainment division of the Military Industrial Complex.

        - Frank Zappa

        • #239849
          closeupready
          Participant
          • Total Posts: 1,335

          @thouartthat

          If what you say is true about Cenk’s motivations (and I agree that it is the likeliest explanation), then that discredits (partially at least) his claim to be an impartial journalist and, more importantly, a reformer who wishes to diminish corporate power.  To the contrary, in firing Chariton, he implicitly endorsed corporate CYA, at the expense of TYT viewers.

          So at the end of the day, Cenk is a good guy, but he has some flaws that make it hard to trust him to make the progressive choice on legislation when faced with opposition from corporate power and money (both from the carrot perspective – Katzenberg’s donation? – and the stick perspective).

          And how can someone run on a platform to be against corporate money in campaign finance … when he takes corporate money to finance his own campaign/career?

          The opinions and personal views expressed herein are solely those of the author, and should never be taken seriously.

          • #239855
            Ohio Barbarian
            Moderator
            • Total Posts: 14,561

            @closeupready Cenk has never said he is an impartial journalist. Quite the contrary, he has consistently said he is a journalist with a progressive bias, but that is important for journalists to report facts. Big difference. The NYT, WaPo, CNN, MSNBC, and Fox claim that they are objective journalists, and they’re lying through their teeth. I’d rather have a progressive or a conservative who actually reports facts than some hack who has an agenda and lies about it.

            As for your other point, what evidence do you have that Cenk would sell out? He’s done nothing that I’ve seen to indicate that is a real possibility. He’s already a millionaire thanks to TYT, and he’s not accepting any corporate or big money donations or even endorsements, so why do you think he would cave to the corporatists? I don’t understand your reasoning.

            It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

            Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

            • #239857
              closeupready
              Participant
              • Total Posts: 1,335

              @ohiobarbarian

              The Ideological Failure Of The Young Turks

              How Corporate Money and Hypocrisy turned TYT into MSM

              In August of 2017, Cenk Uygur struck a deal for $20 million in funding, partly from big time Clinton backer Jeffrey Katzenberg, but it wasn’t the first time he had done so. Three years earlier, Uygur received a $4 million investment from former Republican Governor of Louisiana Buddy Roemer. People scratched their heads. How could a conservative be funding a progressive network? It didn’t appear to change the message however, and TYT continued to rage against the machine. What largely went unnoticed at the time is that another member was added to the TYT board: Kenan Turnacioglu, a limited partner at venture capitalist firm Pointstate Capital. By the time the 2016 election rolled around, Turnacioglu and his firm were throwing money behind their interests, and they were anything but progressive. Turnacioglu himself donated $3,000 to Hillary Clinton — in the primary. He also donated $2,700 to John Kasich, and $10,000 to Cenk Uygur’s WolfPAC. Interestingly enough, Turnacioglu’s boss — Pointstate’s chairman — donated $36,000 to Clinton in 2016, $25,000 to then-Speaker Richard Boehner, and even $2,700 to Chris Christie. Think about that. A member of The Young Turks’ board was actively donating to Hillary Clinton during the 2016 Primary, a time when Bernie Sanders needed all the help he could get against a media and party that rigged the game against him. As it turns out, TYT is connected and financed by the very people who they claim to oppose, and it permeates throughout the network.

              https://medium.com/@RobletoFire/the-ideological-failure-of-the-young-turks-90c15ddde408

              The opinions and personal views expressed herein are solely those of the author, and should never be taken seriously.

          • #239860
            ThouArtThat
            Participant
            • Total Posts: 3,252

            @closeupready

            Hi closeupready,

            Cenk is the CEO of a corporation with some progressive overtones.  Nonetheless, when it comes to running a corporation in present day America, lawsuits trump progressive politics and policies.  Cenk’s shareholders would demand nothing less and he would be obligated as a corporate fiduciary to mind his shareholders.  In other words, he really had little choice in the matter.  The larger reality is that this is what the last 60 years of corporate hegemony has led us to.  Until or unless the corporate legal landscape is changed through progressive policies, this is where we are as a nation, like it or not.  And within those present limitations is the starting point for change that one suspects Cenk is committed to pursuing.

            TAT

            Sooner or later we all sit down to a banquet of consequences.

            - Robert Louis Stevenson

            Politics is the entertainment division of the Military Industrial Complex.

            - Frank Zappa

            • #239863
              closeupready
              Participant
              • Total Posts: 1,335

              @thouartthat

              I suppose if you do not believe in defending yourself, then Cenk’s capitulation, in the face of corporate fearmongering, makes sense.

              I happen to believe in defending myself.  Also, for what it’s worth, due process.  YMMV.

              The opinions and personal views expressed herein are solely those of the author, and should never be taken seriously.

              • #239870
                ThouArtThat
                Participant
                • Total Posts: 3,252

                @closeupready

                Hi closeupready,

                As a corporate executive, Cenk has fiduciary responsibilities by law.  These responsibilities are written into the articles of incorporation that every corporation must abide by.  Just like the mandate that corporations must operate for profit – it is written in the law.  This is what general citizens just don’t appreciate.  Corporations are designed by law to be heartless and soulless machines created for the sole purpose of enriching their shareholders.  It has been this way ever since the first corporations were created in Europe.  Since then, corporate law has codified this philosophy into innumerable shareholder protections from all types of loss and popular political will.  Whether we like it or not, Cenk, like all other “C” level executives, is duty bound to follow the laws governing corporations.  At the end of the day there is no fight for Cenk to fight other than going to Congress to change the rules.

                TAT

                Sooner or later we all sit down to a banquet of consequences.

                - Robert Louis Stevenson

                Politics is the entertainment division of the Military Industrial Complex.

                - Frank Zappa

                • #239894
                  closeupready
                  Participant
                  • Total Posts: 1,335

                  @thouartthat

                  Translation:  Cenk sold out.

                  Agreed.

                  Are we done here?

                  The opinions and personal views expressed herein are solely those of the author, and should never be taken seriously.

                  • #239901
                    ThouArtThat
                    Participant
                    • Total Posts: 3,252

                    @closeupready

                    Hi closeupready,

                    Wrong – Wrong – Wrong.  Stop being obtuse by becoming informed about Corporate Charters and the rules “C” Level Executives must abide by.  Until one does, one will continue to make such misinformed pronouncements.

                    TAT

                    Sooner or later we all sit down to a banquet of consequences.

                    - Robert Louis Stevenson

                    Politics is the entertainment division of the Military Industrial Complex.

                    - Frank Zappa

                    • #239903
                      Ohio Barbarian
                      Moderator
                      • Total Posts: 14,561

                      @thouartthat

                      Don’t judge a man until you have walked for a day in his moccasins.–Native American saying

                      You’ve been there. I’ll take your word for it.

                      It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

                      Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

                      • #239911
                        ThouArtThat
                        Participant
                        • Total Posts: 3,252

                        @ohiobarbarian

                        Hi ob,

                        As soon as Cenk took on outside investors in order to save TYT, his hands became even more tied than otherwise would have been the case.  Had he been successful in keeping TYT a privately held corporation, he would have to answer only to himself.  Nonetheless, even in that situation, the prospect of costly sexual harassment lawsuits would influence his actions because he would still be bound by law to make a profit.  If one wants to fight the corporations, one has to take the fight to Congress.  Expecting the millions of global corporations to become suddenly magnanimous and heartfelt is madness and misplaced.  Indignation over corporate charters and laws is a waste of energy.    Those charters and laws only change with a signature at the end of a pen as a result of legislation.

                        TAT

                        Sooner or later we all sit down to a banquet of consequences.

                        - Robert Louis Stevenson

                        Politics is the entertainment division of the Military Industrial Complex.

                        - Frank Zappa

                    • #239928
                      Voltairine
                      Participant
                      • Total Posts: 1,797

                      When I was CEO of a ltd, I was also member of a Trotskyite party. Gotta have balance in life!

                      No law forced Cenk to take corporate money and sell out. That’s just BS.

                      And you can happily support Cenk for congress without making up BS excuses for TYT.

                      Aloha!

                      • #240087
                        closeupready
                        Participant
                        • Total Posts: 1,335

                        @voltairine – thank you.

                        Just between me and you, selling out is probably great, if you’re the one selling out, lol.  And so probably, you end up being the one to make excuses for everyone else who decides to sell out. 

                        Cenk speaks English.  He can say the word, “no”.  Arguing (as the other one does) that corporate law and all this other stuff serves as Cenk’s puppetmaster, compelling him to take brib … err, donations … no, I’m not buying it, you’re not buying it, and I suspect most people don’t buy it.

                        Peace to you. 

                        The opinions and personal views expressed herein are solely those of the author, and should never be taken seriously.

    • #239876
      KenTankerous
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 939

      Cenk has a few negatives; hell, so does Bernie. But I wholeheartedly support them both, warts and all.

      "If we define an American fascist as one who in case of conflict puts money and power ahead of human beings, then there are undoubtedly several million fascists in the United States."
      - Henry A. Wallace
      (FDR's Vice President until he was forced out by the corrupt forces of obscene wealth.)

    • #239881
      incognito
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 3,830

      You know how I feel about Cenk, OB. For all the reasons you stated in your OP.  I saw Cenk’s Jimmy Dore interview and what he said about the Bernie unendorsement fiasco and I believe what he said. I actually admire him for taking that stance. That issue is buried for me.

      I have also seen the DNC hand picked HORRID woman running against Cenk and would never support someone like her. She’s just an awful, awful person.

      I support Cenk and hope he wins, but with a niggling feeling about him. He was a Republican. He did take millions of dollars from Katzenburg for TYT and he does jump on the Blue No Matter Who Bandwagon which Never helps the Progressive movement. He could have, just as easily, jumped on the Jill Stein bandwagon and chose not to. That bothers me a lot.

      And then, there’s this Primo Nutmeg episode which increased that niggling feeling I have about Cenk… it’s a tad disturbing (follow the money), but I don’t know who Robbie Jaeger is, so I’ll wait until people see this interview and give some feedback. It bothered me.:

      PRIMO NUTMEG #205: Investigating TYT w/ Robbie Jaeger

    • #239885
      David the Gnome
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,604

      @ohiobarbarian

      Basically I agree with you.  I’ve got my doubts about Cenk – and some of the positions he has taken, but I’ve got my doubts about pretty much every candidate.  I’d support him over his opponents, for certain.

    • #239915
      bazukhov
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 2,684

      As in all elections, it comes down to a choice between evils.    If I lived in that district I’d vote for him simply because he appears not to be as bad as his opponent.

      What I look for when I vote is common human decency.   I’m not an ideologue, true believer, or dogmatist.   I’m a registered Democrat only because it gives me the ability to vote in primaries for the lesser evil in the Democratic party.   I owe the party no allegiance or loyalty.  I have my own litmus tests.  i.e. abortion rights.

      I long ago learned that politics is about winning enough votes to get into or stay in office.   If a Democrat strays to far to the right, or fails one of my few litmus tests, I’ll vote 3rd party even though I know that will accomplish nothing but satisfy my pique at the Democratic party and that candidate.

      It’s all about who will govern.   Who is likely to do the most harm?  Who is most likely to do some good for governed?  They rest is all a matter of degree.

      Tell me, great captain, how do the angels sleep when the devil leaves his porch light on? Tom Waites

    • #239916
      xyzse
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,503

      Well, much with everyone else, I can have disagreements with a politician yet still support them at the end.

      Same with Cenk.  Looking at the alternative, his positions are vastly superior.

    • #239925
      Stockholmer
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 502

      I wish Cenk good luck

      he is going to need it

      I predict Christy Smith wins the primary in a rout, but may lose the general if the right Rethug wins their primary, perhaps Mike Garcia, U.S. Navy veteran, who is being backed by some centrist Dummicrats

      Katie Hill got fucked hard, shame she resigned

      she was the only progressive who flipped a red seat in 2018

      • #239929
        Ohio Barbarian
        Moderator
        • Total Posts: 14,561

        @stockholmer Don’t count Cenk out. He’s rapidly raising money, has the most individual donors by far in that race, and over a thousand volunteers. If he raises $1 million, I think he’ll win.

        His district is in Orange County, which has seen a marked decline in disposable incomes for most residents over the last 20 years or so. It’s also very diverse, with a substantial Latino and white working class population which has been ignored and generally doesn’t vote. If Cenk can reach them, he will win.

        If he does win, he is right in describing it as a “political earthquake.” Of course, the same can be said about Bernie Sanders.

        It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

        Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

    • #240063
      tonyl
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 58

      I hope he wins and for no other reason than that a President Sanders is going to need every support he can muster in the halls of that benighted place you call Congress.

    • #240067
      Electrolyte Orchestra
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 303

      We need all the progressives we can get.  Despite some negatives, I think he’d be much much better than another DNC-approved candidate. Even at his worst, he’d probably be better.

    • #240069
      a little weird
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 645

      I would vote for him in a heartbeat if I lived in that district.  He annoys me much of the time and I disagree with him on a lot of things but he is on board with many of the same things I care about.  That’s more than I can say for most politicians.  Maybe I have a different perspective since I have been represented by right-wing republicans for most of my life.  Maybe I’d be pickier if I lived in a blue state.

    • #240074
      Lord Thomas
      Participant
      • Total Posts: 1,032

      I never see it mentioned on here, but Cenk advocates for making Bestiality legal.

      I saw this yesterday, he is sitting with a Lady saying this is ok as long as the animal is being pleasured and if he was ruler of the world he would make it legal.

      The lady with him didn’t know what to say except this is awkward and closed the interview. I was blown away, never heard anybody talk like that in real life.

      I can’t post links, so if anyone wants to google “Cenk Uygur  Bestiality. 

       

       

      • #240086
        Ohio Barbarian
        Moderator
        • Total Posts: 14,561

        @lordthomas That is a lie and a smear. A Vichy Dem smear, to be exact. He was on some show, I think it was part of TYT and maybe Joe Rogan was a guest but I’m not sure, but Cenk was asked by whoever what he thought of people having sex with a horse, and Cenk said something like “So long as the horse is satisfied I have no problem with it.”

        I believe the Humanist Report had a segment on it.

        It was clearly a joke, a raunchy one to be sure, but only a joke. The people spreading this aren’t really offended, of course. It’s fake PC/cancel culture outrage intended to smear Uygur. Notice that none of them talk about any of Cenk’s policy positions. I think it’s a very cowardly way to attack any politician, regardless of their political views.

        It is better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.--Eugene Debs

        Show me a man that gets rich by being a politician, and I'll show you a crook.--Harry Truman

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